What are your religious views?

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What are your religious views?

Deeply religious - I follow a strict religious code and trust my life to a higher authority
22
19%
Somewhat religious - I believe in a higher intelligence watching over us
38
32%
Agnostic - I'm on the fence; you really can't say either way at this time
29
25%
Atheist - I don't believe there is a higher intelligence watching over us
29
25%
 
Total votes: 118

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R99
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby R99 » 24 Feb 2013 15:50

i always think about it, if there is only good in the world, there is not much to live for, some times bad forces us to take challenges, different turns in life . interesting truth. if there is no bad there is no point of being good. little bit confusing. i think, i took this thought in a good way?? did i?? :? or its just me who is thinking this way??
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Ryan
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ryan » 24 Feb 2013 16:23

lucidinthe sky wrote:
taniaaust1 wrote:If everything was all love and roses all the time we just wouldnt be getting challenges in life and doing much growing. Sometimes the hardest things causes us the most growth.


Do you think it's possible that this is the reason why we are here in the first place?

Well, not *entirely* about challenges. I think we're here to experience each other... to interact with each other and to learn to Love. To move our consciousness more towards becoming Love.
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Jack Reacher
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Jack Reacher » 24 Feb 2013 21:41

taniaaust1 wrote:Maybe its not "paying" but a gift. A gift which will help us spiritually develop and grow.


Does this not sound incredibly insensitive to anyone else? I seriously can't fathom how someone can say getting raped in a dark cellar for years on end is a gift.
"There is theoretical abstraction, and then there is true abstraction."

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Ryan
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ryan » 24 Feb 2013 23:31

Jack Reacher wrote:Does this not sound incredibly insensitive to anyone else? I seriously can't fathom how someone can say getting raped in a dark cellar for years on end is a gift.

Anything "sounding" insensitive is a value judgment you're placing on something else.

In any case, I'm not going to comment directly about the scenario you provide, because personally (and on a completely physical perspective), I do agree with you. That's nothing I would wish upon anyone.

But, stand back from the physical for a moment... take a look at any situation as all being consciousness. Does any of it truly matter? Does any of it have any true meaning? What one consciousness does to another and the inherent Intent behind that action is the true meaning of spiritual growth, or spiritual regression.
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Jack Reacher
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Jack Reacher » 25 Feb 2013 00:49

Ryan wrote:
Jack Reacher wrote:Does this not sound incredibly insensitive to anyone else? I seriously can't fathom how someone can say getting raped in a dark cellar for years on end is a gift.

Anything "sounding" insensitive is a value judgment you're placing on something else.

In any case, I'm not going to comment directly about the scenario you provide, because personally (and on a completely physical perspective), I do agree with you. That's nothing I would wish upon anyone.

But, stand back from the physical for a moment... take a look at any situation as all being consciousness. Does any of it truly matter? Does any of it have any true meaning? What one consciousness does to another and the inherent Intent behind that action is the true meaning of spiritual growth, or spiritual regression.


Im really confused about what point you are trying to make here. I guess I value the physical experiences more than this spiritual stuff because well, it never manifests into anything and isn't really real. I think the pain and psychological trauma experienced by that woman is far more important when contemplating this matter than whatever spiritual stuff goes on in the background. So we progress spiritually or we learn a new lesson, or we spiritually regress or whatever. That has nothing to do with the fact that a man decided to rape someone for years on end, I find that point there is far more important than any sort of spiritual justification you can come up with. Its reality.
"There is theoretical abstraction, and then there is true abstraction."

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Worldenterer1
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Worldenterer1 » 25 Feb 2013 01:59

Jack Reacher wrote:Im really confused about what point you are trying to make here. I guess I value the physical experiences more than this spiritual stuff because well, it never manifests into anything and isn't really real. I think the pain and psychological trauma experienced by that woman is far more important when contemplating this matter than whatever spiritual stuff goes on in the background. So we progress spiritually or we learn a new lesson, or we spiritually regress or whatever. That has nothing to do with the fact that a man decided to rape someone for years on end, I find that point there is far more important than any sort of spiritual justification you can come up with. Its reality.


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Jack Reacher
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Jack Reacher » 25 Feb 2013 02:31

Ryan wrote:
Jack Reacher wrote:Does this not sound incredibly insensitive to anyone else? I seriously can't fathom how someone can say getting raped in a dark cellar for years on end is a gift.


But, stand back from the physical for a moment... take a look at any situation as all being consciousness. Does any of it truly matter? Does any of it have any true meaning? What one consciousness does to another and the inherent Intent behind that action is the true meaning of spiritual growth, or spiritual regression.


I just thought I would address this part again. First of all I would like to talk a little bit about my own views seeing as I have become so critical of the other posters. Based on what I have studied from many subjects, news reports, and life experiences and stories of other life experiences its my gut intuition or inference that the human race is the result of a few random chemical reactions and natural evolution processes that wasn't intended by any intelligent order or being. In other words, I think the entire human race is a fluke.

With that in mind if I were to stand back from the physical, I see nothing at all. I see no big picture, no meaning of life, no reason as to why we are here, no purpose that was set in stone. How could I, if I believe there was no higher intelligence that created us or caused us? It would be a contradiction. However I am not depressed by this at all because the other key part of what im about is that we can choose our own purpose, our own values and our own reasons for living. We can also choose to end it as well, there are no boundaries except the ones we make for ourselves and others. However I can also accept that even this could be questioned, we have no control at all, but thats another topic. I justfiy my reasons for believing we can create our own meaning to myself simply from my own experiences.

Now lets say im wrong, which I am open to at all times. Lets say that there is some cosmic order higher than our own understanding of how things work and that from a spiritual point of view this horrible event where the woman was raped meant something in terms of our little karama paradigm. So what? The relevance of consciousness spiritually growing and learning is only relevant with respect to other spiritual concepts. It really doesn't matter at all what happens in the spiritual plane if it exists because we can never transcend from the physical to reach it, its an abstract pseudo-intellectual force that only exists in the heads of those who delude themselves into believing it to justify their actions here in reality. The only spiritual world I can see is so abstract that it isn't worth anything at all except for lofty conversations like this. Its a luxury for us, it has no influence on the physical world where things actually matter, and it can in no way justify an act such as rape.
"There is theoretical abstraction, and then there is true abstraction."

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Ryan
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ryan » 25 Feb 2013 04:28

Thank you Jack for providing us a bit more clarifying view into your perspective. It's always interesting to hear how other people think about things such as life and consciousness. :)

The perspective I've shared above is really one I've come to rather recently. It's the culmination of a rather long spiritual journey... a journey that is always continuing and evolving. I don't expect everyone (or anyone, for that matter) to agree with my perspective. It is what it is.

Another example of my perspective is in relation to Politics (nothing specific mind you lol). I've given up worrying about politics. Why? Because no choice we make really matters and in the end, for the ones who choose to play it, politics is nothing more than a game. Nothing ever changes. In Canada, I'm a Green Party supporter... and I came to the conclusion that even if the Green Party was to win a Majority in the next election, still nothing would change. So, I've chose to stop playing the game... because it really doesn't matter anyway. I simply will not be voting anymore. I know that saying that is going to cause some people to think I'm nuts or to think I'm throwing away my vote, but from my spiritual standpoint, it makes absolutely no sense to me to continue playing a game that has no determining factor upon my spirituality. ((Sorry that was a rather long example LOL))

Instead, I choose to become a better person and not allow things like politics or greed distract me. Spiritual growth, to me, is on a consciousness level... not a physical level. Although, your greatest chances for growth happen on this physical level, in terms of how you interact with other consciousnesses here.
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Worldenterer1
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Worldenterer1 » 25 Feb 2013 04:38

Jack Reacher wrote:
I just thought I would address this part again. First of all I would like to talk a little bit about my own views seeing as I have become so critical of the other posters. Based on what I have studied from many subjects, news reports, and life experiences and stories of other life experiences its my gut intuition or inference that the human race is the result of a few random chemical reactions and natural evolution processes that wasn't intended by any intelligent order or being. In other words, I think the entire human race is a fluke.

With that in mind if I were to stand back from the physical, I see nothing at all. I see no big picture, no meaning of life, no reason as to why we are here, no purpose that was set in stone. How could I, if I believe there was no higher intelligence that created us or caused us? It would be a contradiction. However I am not depressed by this at all because the other key part of what im about is that we can choose our own purpose, our own values and our own reasons for living. We can also choose to end it as well, there are no boundaries except the ones we make for ourselves and others. However I can also accept that even this could be questioned, we have no control at all, but thats another topic. I justfiy my reasons for believing we can create our own meaning to myself simply from my own experiences.

Now lets say im wrong, which I am open to at all times. Lets say that there is some cosmic order higher than our own understanding of how things work and that from a spiritual point of view this horrible event where the woman was raped meant something in terms of our little karama paradigm. So what? The relevance of consciousness spiritually growing and learning is only relevant with respect to other spiritual concepts. It really doesn't matter at all what happens in the spiritual plane if it exists because we can never transcend from the physical to reach it, its an abstract pseudo-intellectual force that only exists in the heads of those who delude themselves into believing it to justify their actions here in reality. The only spiritual world I can see is so abstract that it isn't worth anything at all except for lofty conversations like this. Its a luxury for us, it has no influence on the physical world where things actually matter, and it can in no way justify an act such as rape.


I've been kinda sitting back and watching this one topic go for a bit
and Jack, you just recited everything I believe. :)
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taniaaust1
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby taniaaust1 » 25 Feb 2013 09:04

Interesting to hear of your reality Jake... it makes more sense why you are having trouble seeing how some of our minds are working with our beliefs and probably are very confused on the way we think and how on earth we could think that esp when we arent following any religious belief.

Now lets say im wrong, which I am open to at all times.


Its always good to be open. Due to being open, that has allowed me experience things which I didnt believe were true before I experienced them eg Im not Christian at all but twice have experienced Jesus.. so that was very strange to me. (There are many things I dont believe but are open to believing if Im shown they have some reality to them). I constantly seek out "truth", always analysing my "current beliefs and new ones too.. altering my beliefs as my knowlege and expereinces change.

I'd have to say that my spiritual/religious views are constantly evolving. To add to that confusion.. I have dual levels of beliefs (others who dont have dual belief systems find that very confusing) but interestingly that is possible as they are still true to me.

eg who's got the truth correct?. A cave man cuts his leg open and gets an infection. He believes the infection is due to the cut. A doctor cuts his leg and gets an infection.. he believes the infection is due to bacteria. An energy worker cuts her leg and gets an infection.. she may believe the infection is due to auric damage which is allowing energy to leak and energy contamination to come in and may fix the infection by doing energy healing on her leg.

One could believe ALL THESE THINGS at the same time thou the beliefs at the same time thou they are completely different beliefs. (my beliefs on everything is multi-layed in quite complex ways). I'd believe all those beliefs and if someone asked me the question if I cut my leg.. how I got an infection.. I'd try to respond in a way which the one who's asked me the question would be most likely to understand. (so my posts are quite capable of seeming different at times but I still hold these beliefs and at times the beliefs may seem to conflict to those who dont understand them.

eg I dont think its at all good for someone to be raped..thou I also on another level dont necessarily see it as a bad thing due to other beliefs I carry. Was what Hitler done a negative thing? In many ways I'd say no for various reasons I have due to my beliefs. But on the other hard.. yeah that was terribly aweful thing which occurred and I truely hope humanity dont need to repeat something like that again.

How can I think as I do? its cause I see and experience myself both as a human but also as non human as well (so think from both those views.. the human and the non human.. like I believe we all are)

Anyway.. thanks for sharing where you are coming from. There is nothing wrong with anyone having different beliefs.
The only thing to fear is the fear itself


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