Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

What have you learned from your dream characters? What do they say, what do they represent, what motivates them, why do they exist?
NOCOOKIEFORYOU
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby NOCOOKIEFORYOU » 31 Jul 2013 18:42

Lol I can't. It's hard not to....I need the cookies. I survive on them :D
Tell me and I'll forget.show me and I may not remember.involve me and I'll understand
-native American proverb

AceOfSpades
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby AceOfSpades » 02 Aug 2013 01:18

I take it Cookie Monster and Cookie Nazi (Seinfeld) were already taken hence the name. But I kid.

As for you Haggart dream characters existing in real life. Aside from from what I said earlier regarding Alan Moore and Constantine. It actually really depends on what you mean. Like are you asking if there is a place they go when you are awake, or could they exist in the real world? But existence in of itself, my belief is that if you can see and feel it, it's real regardless of if you alone feel it or anyone else with you can as well. In most of my own lucids I have seen and felt almost anything I laid my eyes and hands on. Even by chance encounter just to see if what I was seeing was real I grabbed someone by the shoulders. Much to my own supply I felt real clothing cloth and skin. If that is not real I don't know what is.

Though now that I think of it. The way you described your DC seems like the Dream World Equivalent to a Time Lord. The same person, but always different in persona and sometimes appearance.

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HAGART
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby HAGART » 02 Aug 2013 01:38

AceOfSpades wrote:Much to my own supply I felt real clothing cloth and skin. If that is not real I don't know what is.


Agreed. They ARE real in the dream the same way we define what is real when awake. Some of them have 'self-preservation' instincts just like any other life form too. It blows me away!
But I have never met one that retained any memories of our last encounter. They seem to just disappear when the dream ends (or even sometimes before it ends), and if I meet another it is a clean slate all over again.

Some of those self-aware type dream characters I meet, although they appear different each time, and have no memory of our last encounter, I have a sneaking suspicion that they are the same 'entity', whatever they may be. Perhaps my subconscious awareness personified, or something more paranormal, but whatever they are, I am very interested and am working on it. My goal is to meet them and say, "Hello again! Remember last time we met?" and start where we left off.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

AceOfSpades
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby AceOfSpades » 02 Aug 2013 01:47

HAGART wrote:
AceOfSpades wrote:Much to my own supply I felt real clothing cloth and skin. If that is not real I don't know what is.


Agreed. They ARE real in the dream the same way we define what is real when awake. Some of them have 'self-preservation' instincts just like any other life form too. It blows me away!
But I have never met one that retained any memories of our last encounter. They seem to just disappear when the dream ends (or even sometimes before it ends), and if I meet another it is a clean slate all over again.

Some of those self-aware type dream characters I meet, although they appear different each time, and have no memory of our last encounter, I have a sneaking suspicion that they are the same 'entity', whatever they may be. Perhaps my subconscious awareness personified, or something more paranormal, but whatever they are, I am very interested and am working on it. My goal is to meet them and say, "Hello again! Remember last time we met?" and start where we left off.

I meant to say surprise, damn auto correct. The way I see it, only speaking from my own experience there are three factors when it comes to a dream character. The first factor is that many of them stem from the memories of your friends and loved ones hence why some dreams before they become nightmares often depict a good day to have with a family member or a close friend. The other factor is characters spawned from your own subconscious which are split into two or more groups. The first group being different versions of you be it who you are on the inside and who you want to be. The second being your perception of characters you seen in a movie or a TV show. The third factor though and this one I truely believe is that the character is not a character at all but an Avatar of an outside force who some how got in from another person to an entity from another world. This person would not only feel as real as they look but unlike the examples I mentioned who are zombies convinced that the dream world is the real world. This Factor knows the world you and he/her/it inhabit are not real. The first version of yours may be a factor 3 while the "Different person" is a factor 2 posing as a factor 3.

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HAGART
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby HAGART » 02 Aug 2013 01:57

AceOfSpades wrote:I meant to say surprise, damn auto correct.


LOL. I was a little confused, but actually thought maybe it's some sort of slang, and I am an idiot. Regardless of that damn auto-correct, I understand the content of what you are saying and that is more important.

We all have our own theories why, but there is a clear distinction between a DC that knows it is a dream and others that don't. That's undeniable to anybody who has experienced it. Some have a full personality separate from my own and others are like mindless drones. This one in particular was about half-way between.

And we can't answer this with one post or one thread. That's what this whole section, sub-forum is for. And I am not afraid to say those three words most people dread: I DON'T KNOW!
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

AceOfSpades
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby AceOfSpades » 02 Aug 2013 02:14

Knowing things makes us people, but when we reach the point of saying those 3 words it makes us human. Well you anyway. Me I am not even sure what I am. My look is human but the way I talk has often sounded otherworldly. Maybe these lucids taken toll on my mind or maybe something else. Anyway, don't wanna ramble on. In between you say? Now that is a supply (Surprise. That wasn't auto correct this time. Since you thought it was a slang I decided to make it one.). When I am not going in and out of the lucid world one of the few things I have tried to put together as sort of a hobby was trying to create an A.I. One thing that always intrigues me about A.I. is that it starts out as a drone, but upon development be it by it's developer or itself is that it eventually takes a life of its own. Goes from a robot created from codes and set patterns to a living artificial being with a mind and emotions. Your in betweener sounds like the Lucid equivalent to a robot gaining a mind of it's own, evolving for lack of a better word. Never have I known to see that happen.

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HAGART
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby HAGART » 02 Aug 2013 02:51

Maybe this is going off tangent, but I like this discussion.

I believe that an artificial intelligence can be created in a computer. It requires some creative programming and allow it to evolve and learn on it's own. You can use the human brain as a model. Once created though, it is self aware, has a sense of self-preservation and starts to think about it's own existence and what is beyond it's scope of reality beyond the machine it inhabits. Give it some way to sense the physical world or feed it 'artificial' physical sensations, and you have a life form. IT'S ALIVE! It's like Frankenstein's Monster or HAL from 'A Space Oddessy'.

What does it mean to be 'alive'? Some argue that fire acts like life, because it feeds, grows and procreates with embers. Philosophers have pondered this for ages, long before any of us, and we still don't have a concrete answer that I can stand on and say, "YES! That's the way it is."

I still use those three words, which doesn't make me weak. I am just honest. And proud of it!

GOOD TALK!
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

AceOfSpades
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Re: Do dream characters exist beyond the dream? I asked one.

Postby AceOfSpades » 02 Aug 2013 03:17

Thanks I love a good philosophical conversation. But ya this quote though might turn around your "I Don't Know." Ironically it's from a work of fiction.

From Justice League episode Legends.
Green Lantern: It's stupid really. Why should I feel like this? I mean, they weren't even real.
Hawkgirl: They gave their lives for us. That's real enough for me.


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