Trouble with LD

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Dynamo
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Trouble with LD

Postby Dynamo » 29 May 2014 18:08

So, on school days (monday night to thursday night) I never dream lucid. But then friday night I always get a LD dream. It is always very short (never think of rubbing my hands). But to get one I do this:

1) I close my eyes and release the tension of my body. I relax it. At that point (few seconds later) I get these yellow spots in front of my eyes, but i can't make shapes out of it. Are those things the hypnagogia?

2) I am lying very still then and just relax. Normally my brain would think im asleep so I would get into sleep paralyses. But i just fall asleep. Is there any way to stay awake long enough to get into the state i should be?

3) I woke op around 8 am, it was very early so i could go to sleep very easy. So i tried the above technique again. I heard the voice of my mom talking to my dad. Then a bit later i fell asleep again. I came to know later she didn't talk at all. So was I in sleep paralyses then? If so, it felt just like IRL.

Thanks for reading

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nesgirl
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Re: Trouble with LD

Postby nesgirl » 29 May 2014 18:51

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Last edited by nesgirl on 21 May 2015 06:46, edited 1 time in total.
Goodbye forever...
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HAGART
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Re: Trouble with LD

Postby HAGART » 31 May 2014 06:43

What is IRL? Does it mean: In Real Life?

As for question 3). WBTB is best done when you are awake, and yet still have time to sleep. You could get up if you absolutely had to, but could also sleep in. That's why weekends work best for most people. Lucid dreams for me tend to happen when I sleep in an extra hour longer than I have habitually had. It's like my mind wakes up out of habit, but I am in a dream. (Mind awake; Body asleep).

I get audible hallucinations a lot and it comes with the territory. Go with it, explore it, become acquainted with it, and it can become a cue that a Wake Induced Lucid Dream is about to happen (or perhaps has already started). If you don't succeed, it's always a good story to record in your dream journal. (Even I get duped all the time and don't realize I was already dreaming!)

It can truly feel like "IRL". That's why it's, so hard to notice.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

Dynamo
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Joined: 16 Apr 2014 17:44

Re: Trouble with LD

Postby Dynamo » 01 Jun 2014 16:22

Thanks! most of the time when I have a lucid dream, I get a false awakening, but by doing a reality check when I wake up it should become another LD.

How long should you be awake before those yellow spots in front of my eyes become a "shape"?

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HAGART
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Re: Trouble with LD

Postby HAGART » 03 Jun 2014 01:51

Can't answer that. I actually don't follow hypnagogia into a lucid dream. I know what it is and get short flashes of shapes and things when in that state, but I always fall asleep without realizing it.

But they usually lead to false awakenings in which I am in bed still trying to sleep! And don't realize it until I notice something odd and wonder where I was 5 minutes ago and how I got to where I was. Or feel a strange sensation like floating, sinking, vibrations and all that.

I have never really used hypnogogic imagery at all and if I have ever seen it, it was by accident when I just happened to be in the right state of mind at the right time.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

Snaggle
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Re: Trouble with LD

Postby Snaggle » 03 Jun 2014 07:33

Dynamo wrote:
1) I close my eyes and release the tension of my body. I relax it. At that point (few seconds later) I get these yellow spots in front of my eyes, but i can't make shapes out of it. Are those things the hypnagogia?

2) I am lying very still then and just relax. Normally my brain would think im asleep so I would get into sleep paralyses. But i just fall asleep. Is there any way to stay awake long enough to get into the state i should be?

3) I woke op around
8 am, it was very early so i could go to sleep very easy. So i tried the above technique again. I heard the voice of my mom talking to my dad. Then a bit later i fell asleep again. I came to know later she didn't talk at all. So was I in sleep paralyses then? If so, it felt just like IRL.


#1 Most likely these spots are not hypnagogic images. There are two things these spots could be. Ones eyes don't take a single image and translate it whole into the brain. Rather a number of rods unite or create an image from what they individually see. If you're near-sighted (like me) one can eye what with these individual rods, e.g. walking into a city from the countryside the street lights don't look like street lights, their broken into a large ball with numerous balls of light, rather like a Christmas tree. When one closes ones eyes one if one looks for them see pinpoint lights, which as actually these rods trying to pick up any light and see it.

The second thing they could be is after images. If one looks at any bright light and then closes ones eyes one will see after images, but these are usually in irregular shapes. I've almost always looked at clouds to see shapes and at these images too to see shapes and have riden them into real hypnagogic images.

#2 It's abnormal to enter REM muscle atonia directly upon falling asleep. RMA occurs long after one has been asleep. Normal sleep goes: relax the body; relax the brain; lose consciousness; hypnagogic images start (which normally you're not aware of); then NREM dreams start; then one enters dreamless deep sleep; then REM Muscle Atonia; then REM dreams. During normal sleep ones brain is must active during REM sleep and normal REM sleep happens after the brain is the most turned off, as it starts to speed up RMA starts to keep the body from acting out, as the sleeper has a consciousness close to waking consciousness, but they have no awareness of their real body and real physically act out their dreams, except for RMA. Put in a nutshell during deep sleep/Delta sleep ones brain is getting it's most perfect sleep and as it starts to wake up RMA starts putting the body into it's most perfect state of sleep, during which the brain is in the lala land of REM sleep.
So, on school days (monday night to thursday night) I never dream lucid. But then friday night I always get a LD dream. It is always very short (never think of rubbing my hands). But to get one I do this:
The Sleep Paralysis experience is something other then RMA when you're awake. It's a type of dream which is why it breaks into other dreams so easilly. If some one was really awake during RMA they would not be normally experiencing any sort of dream images and ones brain would have to slow down to enter REM sleep. Most likely SP experiencers are experiencing dreams inspired by RMA - ones real body state can inspire dreams. Sleep researchers have artificially induced SP experiences by waking people up during sleep, those tired often fall back directly into REM sleep and often have SPE. Narcoleptics also fall asleep almost instantly and into REM sleep and they're the people who experience the most SPE, a lot (maybe all of them) claim to never lose consciousness ever during sleep (there lack of Delta sleep may be why they're narcoleptics).

#3 Hearing voices is normal during NREM sleep and dreams. During them one has awareness of ones real body and the real world, but dreams are running too and sometimes whether something is being experienced in the real world or the dream world is not clear.e.g. I occassionally hear my voice being called in NREM dreams and think it's happening in the real world even though in a lucid NREM dream or sometimes in a non luicid dream. You were dreaming when you heard that "conversation". This might have been hypnagogia or an actual dream - most likely hynagogia because of it's extreme simplicity.
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taniaaust1
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Re: Trouble with LD

Postby taniaaust1 » 03 Jun 2014 07:58

Dynamo wrote: 1) I close my eyes and release the tension of my body. I relax it. At that point (few seconds later) I get these yellow spots in front of my eyes, but i can't make shapes out of it. Are those things the hypnagogia?


I dont know but you could use anything like that for a WILD. Instead of trying to make shapes out of .. instead focus on it and imagine yourself getting closer and closer to it as you focus (it will get bigger the closer you get or may morph itself). If you can get close enough, you should find you can enter into it, which probably will take you into a dream scene.

Ive found little patches of colour very helpful for WILD entry.


2) I am lying very still then and just relax. Normally my brain would think im asleep so I would get into sleep paralyses. But i just fall asleep. Is there any way to stay awake long enough to get into the state i should be?


You need to engage your mind more to stop your mind from falling unawarely asleep. People do this various ways.. some do counting (I personally dont like that for me). I prefer to observe my breathing and sometimes use a mantra in time with the breath. If you have that yellow spot you could try to use that to maintain your focus if that isnt too boring. You could also try not laying in your normal sleep position.. eg try laying on your back instead.



3) I woke op around 8 am, it was very early so i could go to sleep very easy. So i tried the above technique again. I heard the voice of my mom talking to my dad. Then a bit later i fell asleep again. I came to know later she didn't talk at all. So was I in sleep paralyses then? If so, it felt just like IRL.

Thanks for reading


That's probably my best times to have a WILD. Just after I've just woke up in the morning.. feeling refreshed but still quite sleepy. No.. sleep paralyses is when someone cant move, it isnt necessarily anything to do with hearing things. You were getting hypnagogic halluncination sounds and starting to enter a dream. You missed your LD. I suggest to stick with what you did there as obviously it did work for you, you just need to not be fooled by thinking what you hear in that state is all real.
The only thing to fear is the fear itself

Dynamo
Posts: 24
Joined: 16 Apr 2014 17:44

Re: Trouble with LD

Postby Dynamo » 04 Jun 2014 21:44

thanks for the answers!! can't wait to try them :)


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