Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Discuss paranormal activity linked with sleep and dreams, such as out of body experiences, astral projection and psychic dreams.
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Karin
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby Karin » 30 May 2014 15:43

HAGART wrote: Great minds think alike! I actually did this and shared my experiment on this forum. I thought I was original and came up with it first, but even Summerlander had tried it long before me. It's an easy, simple experiment for anyone prone to "out of body dreams". I call it, (OBE... Out of BED Experience) ;). I wasn't successful, and concluded that I was only in a WILD. I had another two this morning. I have a very realistic feeling of a body and can touch things, feel the cold snow, and wet water, but it was clearly a dream since it is almost June here and getting hot in real life!

Here's a link to that experiment right here in this forum in the Science Section:
http://www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=13776
Just because I couldn't do it in my 2-3 attempts doesn't mean I disproved it either. I should setup a deck of cards and try again! Reading it again, I was overly scientific, but that's because I didn't want any loop-holes and wanted to be precise. But I couldn't help but lace it with some of my conspiracy theories, I can't help it. ;)


Cool! I'll check that thread, thanks for sharing your experiences! I joined a few weeks ago and I am very behind in exploring the large amount of info available on this forum. :oops:

I too love a sprinkle of conspiracy theories, LOL! :D Makes everything more interesting, but I avoid over-indulging or being sucked into it (been there, done that).

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taniaaust1
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby taniaaust1 » 03 Jun 2014 13:49

erichsa wrote: I am reading for the first time that you can see things which are in a place you have not looked or shall I say, seen before while OBE. Taniaaust1 that is great. because I thought it is not possible to-do that. :)


I guess if I didnt have that experience and one other experience I had with that stuff too (I moved something when trying to project to a place which 2 others who were physicallly in a room experienced), probably seeing anothers photos of a couple of astral projectors while out of body may not have been enough to fully convince me and I'd be doubting like HAGART does, still wondering if OBEs were just LDs.

All it takes is one or two big experience with it and one cant doubt any more that there can be some real physical interaction going on.
.....

edit I just remembered another experience I had with this. I was astrally at my dying aunts bedside and knew exactly where she died as I was astrally there. She'd been sick for 8mths? a year?? before this and there was nothing physically at all that had warned me that that was about to happen. I hadnt spoken to her or her children for ages.

All these things werent planned, they just happened. I was doing astral projection at the time and they just happened when I got out. Ive never tried anything planned to prove it to myself as I didnt need to with experiences like that, it like proved itself to me.
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taniaaust1
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby taniaaust1 » 03 Jun 2014 14:06

Karin wrote: If one looks at physical reality like a dream our higher consciousness is having, then there is no reason that my higher consciousness should not be able to know everything about everything within that dream, since my consciousness is the one having the dream within itself. Then things like remote viewing, precognition, OBEs, telepathy, and so on and so forth, make perfect sense... Unless my higher consciousness decide to set up limitations within the dream, just for the fun of it (to see if its own self dream character can be smart enough to 'crack' the limitations)?


umm.. I guess I could say that maybe my OBEs could of been psychic experiences instead but experiences I experienced from an OBE point of view. Lucid dreaming psychic experiences involving telepathy for one? and remote viewing for others? and oh what's it called when one makes something move with energy? for another. I doubt it.

Kind of easier to believe thou that they were OBEs rather then Im skilled in all those other areas. Ive tried very hard to move objects with my mind when not out of body and I dont have any ounce of skill in that one at all! (I tried so hard on several occassions during meditation states that it made my head hurt). I cant even move a match stick (during an OBE thou I some how moved a chair).

Anyway.. all these things are food for thought and I guess such experiences could be things like remote viewing (but then that isnt all that different to OBE.. the persons energy goes to a location and they pick up info on it. A remote viewing person is experiencing being in two locations at once).
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby taniaaust1 » 03 Jun 2014 14:19

HAGART wrote: I wasn't successful, and concluded that I was only in a WILD. I had another two this morning. I have a very realistic feeling of a body and can touch things, feel the cold snow, and wet water, but it was clearly a dream since it is almost June here and getting hot in real life!

Here's a link to that experiment right here in this forum in the Science Section:
http://www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=13776
Just because I couldn't do it in my 2-3 attempts doesn't mean I disproved it either. I should setup a deck of cards and try again! Reading it again, I was overly scientific, but that's because I didn't want any loop-holes and wanted to be precise. But I couldn't help but lace it with some of my conspiracy theories, I can't help it. ;)


Nods, LDs can feel soo very real like too. Wet feels wet, cold feels cold etc and the DCs often in mine act like real people do (but are snobs!). My lucid dreams feel extremely real like too.

I dont think there is any issue with being scientific, if you are trying to prove to yourself if something could exist or not, you need to be and need to leave no loopholes.

I havent seen your thread on your experiment so will check it out.

If the looking at a card doesnt work, I wouldnt try doing that again as it shows you havent experienced if you got it wrong. You cant force it to happen from a LD state.

Try the experiement only again if there is something feeling different about your LD then normal which makes you actually question that "maybe this one is a OBE?" (so probably a good idea to keep a card on top of the wardrobe face up just in case you do experience something like that.. something with an inner knowin that it probably isnt a LD.. I get a feel with it.. I cant describe it.. its a knowing feel. Is like a precog dream, it feels different).
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby patches » 16 Aug 2014 09:09

Karin wrote:Here's my opinion, for what it's worth:

According to today's mainstream science, the brain generates consciousness (though they don't have proof for that, it's just an assumption of science). So according to mainstream science, astral projections, or life after death, or remote viewing, and so on, are impossible, because such things do not fit with the current scientific paradigm.

On the other hand, there are many anecdotical stories about people having experiences that contradict the above: near death experiences where the patient recalls everything that happened in the ER even though they were brain-dead at the time, astral projections where people claim to see things happening in the real world that they later were able to verify really happened, telepathic experiences, psychic experiences, channeling entities, etc...

However, the above experiences do not constitute scientific evidence, because even though often there were witnesses, these experiences cannot be reproduced on demand and there is not really any way to either confirm or disprove them. After all, the one who had the experience (and the witnesses) could just have been hallucinating, having a fit of collective hysteria, or simply having an overactive imagination. Or they could even be lying, trying to sell something, or attract attention.

My opinion is that we all have to make up our own mind and it's our personal responsibility to chose what we want to believe. That's why I am trying to explore states of consciousness so I can 'see for myself', as opposed to have to base my judgment solely on someone else's experiences and stories (even though I sure am interested to hear them).

For a long time, as a scientist, I have blindly believed what mainstream science was saying, forgetting that there still is a lot that science does not know and cannot even conceive of. There is a lot science knows about the physical world, but maybe the physical world isn't all there is, but is just one 'layer' of a bigger reality. Maybe this bigger reality is not accessible through our five senses or through our scientific instruments, but that does not mean it isn't there. Maybe our consciousness isn't generated in the brain, but rather, the brain focuses the consciousness into the physical world so that we can experience it through the five senses. And maybe if I can free a portion of my consciousness from the shackles of the brain, I might be able to become more aware of those worlds beyond the physical world, and then bring back some data about these experiences into the brain when I wake up.

"Otherwise, I will just continue believing that it all begins and ends in our own minds." I actually also believe this, even though I prefer to use 'consciousness' instead of 'mind'. I believe it all begins and ends in our consciousness, including the physical world. I believe the physical world is a type of collective dream we are all having. In this dream, it seems as if I have finite body separate of the rest of the world, just like it appears I have a body in my nighttime dreams. In the physical reality dream, I am not conscious of anything outside physical reality, and I can't remember anything about the time before I was born, just like in my normal nighttime dreams I am not aware that I am dreaming and do not remember anything about my 'real waking life'.

That's why I think lucid dreaming is so fascinating, because I believe lucid dreams can hold clues about how physical reality works. What if one could become 'lucid' in physical reality? What if we could become fully aware of who we really are as multidimensional consciousness and become able to have more 'control' about the way our real life unfolds? To quote Bashar, we could start to 'live our dream instead of dreaming to be alive'.

Karin



Karin, I couldn't agree more. It seems rather obvious that we shouldn't assume that mainstream science has all of the answers, or that the answers they come up with are necessarily 100% correct. They absolutely discount any evidence to the contrary...and there is thousands of years of anecdotal evidence. At the very least, it should be acknowledged that there's something going on that can't yet be explained, and it should warrant further investigation before stating as fact that there's no such thing.
I've had some pretty incredible experiences myself, so I keep an open mind - I don't discount any theories. Of course, because of what I've experienced as well as the experiences of people close to me, I lean toward the "yes, astral projection and spirit entities are real" side...and I hope it's true, bc the world would be so much more interesting if it were.

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HAGART
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby HAGART » 16 Aug 2014 19:16

Reading your other post about sleep paralysis, and "The Hooded Man", and even experiencing it while awake, I just had an idea that might explain it, and it relates to this thread. It could be a Tulpa, a thoughtform or entity, that we conjure. Many children report having vivid imaginary friends, so I think there's a lot of truth to it. Maybe it isn't objectively real, but to the subjective individual it can be. And we all know the mind is a powerful thing still yet to be fully understood.

These entities can become very real, but you have to truly believe in it. We dream about what we believe and then use the dream as proof of what we already believe so it creates a cycle that reinforces the idea so much that it truly does become subjectively real. You may have unwittingly created a menacing thoughtform with strong belief.

There's a mysterious cult known as Beleibers that worship an entity known as Justin Beiber. It too is menacing and pees in janitor buckets, throws eggs, and has petty fights with Orlando Bloom. There's no way that guy's for real! If people stopped beleibing, the entity would disappear from the airwaves and no longer be a part of our collective consciousness. (That's what I did with my shadow figure I use to see during my false awakenings... I just ignored it and it went away). But there's always a positive side, and perhaps The Beiber should be kept after all. The entity also creates great material for late night talk show monologues. ;)

Maybe your 'spirit entity' is either good or bad depending on how you perceive it, and there's a way to keep your, Tulpa, thoughtform, shadow figure, hallucination, or whatever it is, and turn it into a positive, constructive one.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby patches » 17 Aug 2014 07:29

First of all, I agree 100% about the most frightening beiber entity. I don't even think we need the material for late night, there are plenty of other entities that can fill that role. Some things just shouldn't be messed with.
I've also considered the possibility that this Hooded Man was some sort of something that I'd accidentally created somehow...but a couple things that puzzle me about this:
1) why do so many ppl around the world see the exact same figure? In detail...not just a shadowy figure, but a 7-ft blacker than black hooded figure with no facial features, scary eyes, and even down to the detail of giving off a sense of boiling rage? I just don't see how so many ppl from different backgrounds and cultures could be imagining the same thing.
2) the scariest part about the encounter was the fact that the next morning, (as I was trying not to think about my horrible hallucinAtion from the night before), my 3yr old daughter saw him as well? She woke up, went to my bedroom, and started screaming like i'd never heard her scream before (or since), and After finally calming down enough to speak, said there wAs a "bad man" in my bedroom. I asked her to describe him, she said he wAs "really tall, is all black, has long black hair in front of his face (like the hood)," and she "couldn't see his face, but he had creeeeeepy eyes...".
That. Freaked. Me out.

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illumy
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby illumy » 17 Aug 2014 19:29

I think what's absolutely key here, is that we first must define what is, "Real".

"Real" can be different things, to different people.

Do you think life here on Earth, is, ..."Real", just because when you miss with your swinging hammer, and hit your hand, it hurts?

Allow me to tell you that, pain is identical, even when you are somewhere other than here, only more so.

"More so", in that, any one who successfully travels, either astrally, or lucidly, will tell you that it is far more, "Real" than being aware here on Earth.

How can that be, ...but it is.

So, being somewhere other than consciously here on Earth, is "more" real than being on Earth, what does that tell us? That Earth is real, or that they are all real?

I once read somewhere, that, reality, your own personal reality, is where your consciousness is one hundred percent focused at that given moment.

That statement is very heavy to grasp, but if you take your time, and tear that statement apart, it works.

For instance, why do you awaken from a nightmare, sit straight up, and thank God that, that was only a dream?

Because while you were there, in your nightmare, your complete conscious was one hundred percent focused at that (location/plane/level) etc., and when you "woke up", did you really, "wake up", or did you (re-focus/shift) your conscience back to this plane.

While you were there, in your nightmare, that was real. That was your reality at that point in time. That's why it had such immense impact on you. Do you think anything, "fake" is going to effect you to that degree? And then, you may argue in your defense, that in your dream, you saw three headed pigs, or what ever scenario that would not be of "this world". While in your dream, you weren't hear, in this world. Physically you were, but that physical part dies, and decays eventually. You visited that dream world, with you conscience, which never dies, or decays, because in its fundamental form, is energy. Again, each, (world/level/plane), would have its own, "rule set", ie things that are normal on that plane of existence. And just because we don't have three headed pigs on earth, or, this plane, doesn't mean that three headed pigs aren't the norm, wherever you visited.

Look, we all die, animals die, plants die. That, in and of itself, proves that here, Earth, is not the Be All, the End All, the Cure All. If it was, nothing would die, we would all stay here for eternity".

So that means that we have to start looking beyond the scope of "man made" science, and thinking.

Science is a good thing, don't get me wrong, and it strives to make logic out of things on this (level/plane), but science is limiting, at best. Science can only accept as reality, things that science can prove. And any logical thinking entity, is fully aware that, things such as space, the human mind, astral travel, etc., are to vast, and ineffable for science to lasso, just yet. And just because science can't prove it, ...it's fake, it's not real, it's folklore, it's chemicals in a dying brain.

Well, thank goodness for the new wave of scientific thinking. It started with Einstein, and has been growing, albeit slowly, ever since. More and more scientists, as well as physicists, are finally realizing how narrow minded, and dogmatic the science of old, really is.

Immense leaders on the forefront of this new revolution include Dr Eben Alexander, and Dr Thomas Campbell, both of which have enormous resources available on YouTube.

Dr Eben Alexander for instance, a neurosurgeon and staunch believer that when you died, that was it, had a near death experience, now fights to the death to say that we are all wrong, that there is more than here, and now. This is a scientifically, and medically trained professional, who after only one near death experience, is re-writing his entire philosophy of existence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZqTSBvwRQo

So in closing, "never say never".

Just because science cannot prove something, does not mean that it doesn't exist.

What we discuss here on this Forum, astral travel, OBE's etc., is light-years ahead of "today's" science. Not that sometime in the not so distant future, science will finally be able to test this type of travel, but for right now, they'll just have to deny it. Far too many human beings, having far too many unexplainable experiences, for it to all be fake.

Stay strong, continue to explore things you cant yet prove, and use, as Dr Thomas Campbell bases all of his experimental travel on, ..."open minded skepticism".

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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby HAGART » 17 Aug 2014 21:15

I question what is "Real" too. The only thing physics can truly do, is know the mathematical relationships between 'stuff'. (Orbits, electromagnetic waves and all that is really just saying.... when this happens, this will also happen and by this much). Then it gets crazy at the quantum level when things are only probable until measured and perceived by a consciousness, but I don't know too much about it. :o Everything else is interpreted by our brains, and we create our whole 3D environment full of color and sound from simple waves and jiggling things called 'atoms'. We also go further, and layer on top of that, our emotions, memories and imaginations. That means that our personal 'reality' is unique and is pretty much a dream... an illusion. I think Buddhist monks figured that out centuries ago. ;) And even time is perhaps an illusion because as soon as you try to measure the present, it's gone! (I could talk about that sort of stuff all day, and there's too much to discuss in a single post).

So are dreams real? Yes. They really did happen. If I were to look back on all the things I've done and experienced in my life time, I mustn't distinguish between dream, and waking reality, for both are equally 'real' as part of my entire human experience as a whole. Dreams are a real part of my life. And in the moment of the dream, for all intense and purposes, that is your whole reality for the moment. That's how I prolong lucid dreams when I feel them slipping away. I touch things, look around, move my body so that I stay in the dream and my entire focus is drawn back to that version of reality. Our reality really is, whatever we are focused on at any given moment.

With that said, here is what I mean by the main question. Are there places, like an Astral Plane, that exist beyond our own subjective experience, and can be verified by more than one person. If you describe the place to someone, can they answer, "Yea, I've been there too! I etched my name on a tree and you can go and find it there." Or you might meet a dream character who is not just in your mind, but also visits other people as if it has a life of it's own. (Just like defining 'reality' defining 'life' is another whole new can of worms to open!) It can be complicated when my definition of 'reality' and 'life' are not exactly the same as what the average person would think. (In fact, I still don't have a solid definition of those yet!)

I just posed more questions than I answered. ;)
Last edited by HAGART on 08 Feb 2015 14:39, edited 1 time in total.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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HAGART
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Re: Are Astral Projections and "Spirit Entities" Real?

Postby HAGART » 17 Aug 2014 22:25

patches wrote:1) why do so many ppl around the world see the exact same figure? In detail...not just a shadowy figure, but a 7-ft blacker than black hooded figure with no facial features, scary eyes, and even down to the detail of giving off a sense of boiling rage? I just don't see how so many ppl from different backgrounds and cultures could be imagining the same thing.


I belieb... er I mean, I believe, that this is due to the Collective Unconscious coined by Carl Jung. I looked it up on Wikipedia just to make sure, and I was surprised to actually find "The Shadow" mentioned as one of the archetypes! That means it's very primitive in all our psyche and we are born with it before any life experience, therefore, it will be very similar for all humans regardless of cultural upbringing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collective_unconscious
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadow_%28psychology%29


I never did much research on it so I found these interesting. This is just food for thought and being Wikipedia, it's more of an appetizer.

patches wrote:2) the scariest part about the encounter was the fact that the next morning, (as I was trying not to think about my horrible hallucinAtion from the night before), my 3yr old daughter saw him as well? She woke up, went to my bedroom, and started screaming like i'd never heard her scream before (or since), and After finally calming down enough to speak, said there wAs a "bad man" in my bedroom. I asked her to describe him, she said he wAs "really tall, is all black, has long black hair in front of his face (like the hood)," and she "couldn't see his face, but he had creeeeeepy eyes...".


So your daughter saw it in a dream, not in 'real' physical life?
I've heard accounts of dream sharing before. Taniaust1, (forget where her post is), but reported sharing a nightmare with her daughter. It was the other way around and she was in her daughter's dream. Perhaps your daughter dream shared with you. Many reports of precognition, and telekinesis (like just knowing someone is in trouble), all tend to have one thing in common: A strong emotional bond between the two people. A mother/daughter bond is very strong, and a sleep paralysis nightmare is a very strong emotion.

My two explanations actually reinforce my belief that it all begins and ends in our minds. But it's still an interesting world and truth is stranger than fiction.

Robert Waggoner who has published some books on lucid dreaming, and meditates, is a credible, down to Earth person and I saw an interview on YouTube in which he reported having a precognitive/mind-sharing moment. (It was over a year ago, so my memory may not be 100% accurate). When meditating he gained an unshakable knowledge that one of his old friends was in financial trouble, and after calling him up, it turned out that his friend's mother had died and he couldn't cover the funeral expenses. (Strong emotion + relationship).

Michael Persinger is a cognitive neuroscience researcher who is not afraid to tackle and explain some paranormal activity. He did studies on remote viewing and even speculates that we can transmit our thoughts through the Earth's magnetosphere. Since our brains produce waves, they can be transmitted. The Earth's magnetic field is about 40Hz. Guess what else is 40Hz? Our brain waves during The Phase State. The Phase state is a term that encompasses all Lucid Dreams, Astral Projections, OOBE, and even some False Awakenings, and those Sleep Paralysis Nightmares. Essentially it's a period of 'body asleep/mind awake'.

I don't know if I'm right or wrong, and it doesn't matter. You can do your own Google search of course. It's just fun to talk about this stuff. :D
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.


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