Jack Reacher wrote:I hope this topic doesn't come off as being too dark, but I think its an interesting philosophical question. To me it seems that a spiritual belief is a belief that is really based on a kind of faith, there is little scientific evidence that supports it but none that rejects it. In order to actually believe in a spiritual concept, you have to think of it in an irrational way, in other words believe in it simply because your intuition thinks its right.
I'm not sure if i really understand this post. I think you are just maybe questioning your own beliefs about spirituality and wondering if others feel the same?? The good old idea about the right brain and left brain being separate and operating independently. A lot of things that are spiritual are considered "irrational" but how do we know that's just what we've been told?? How do you know if you don't operate with both your rational and irrational mind as a spiritual being??? And if these experiences are so irrational why do they happen to even the most rational minded most scientific minded people?? In fact why does it happen at all ?? That's more like it!
Hmm i don't even really know what spirituality is apart from the fact that it's living as a spirit in a body and having different experiences on different levels. I used to think spirituality was a path, and I'm spiritual but then my own experiences have challenged my own beliefs. Maybe there's different definitions of everything, and it need not necessarily be put in one box. I'm only going to speak for myself. Since being outside the confines of religion I've learned much much more about the universe, the Bible, the human mind, society, possible answers to so-called "unexplained scientific phenonema" like bermuda triangle, bigfoot, aliens, ESP, psychic ability, deja vu, ufos, and it goes on and on and on and on, and also other galaxies, aspects of myself, the nature of reality, the human body and health and literally still learning.I used to think some of these things were "evil" since that's what I was taught, and I didn't even know about some of these things ...or so i thought...maybe i already did...but all it was doing was limitting myself and my mind. The more i studied them the more my mind opened or maybe even "re-opened".
I feel like any questions we could possibly have already have an answer because there's tons of information out there on the internet and even through psychedelics like DMT, ayahuasca, in books, ancient artifacts, ancient carvings and sculptures, through lucid dreams and even some people are and have been able to access Akashic records like Edgar Cayce and others..Is there anything we couldn't possibly do or access?! It's like someone somewhere has already answered the question or discovered it, maybe ancient civilisations already drew it on carvings and walls. Like how people discover the way the solar system is , or the structure of the earth or the flower of life and how it's the template from which every living thing is created and about so-called hidden things that our governments, illuminati, secret societies or whatever are trying to distract us from. What if we already know these things?? What if you could simply tap into the collective unconscious mind and draw out everything you wanted..it's not like this hasn't been written about or studied in psychology or metaphysics!! Of course these may be considered irrational, or may have been, but i feel most could even be explained and studied by science if scientists wanted..how about the face on Mars, or polar shifts that have occured changing the position of the north and south poles due to major catastrophes like Noah's flood..? There's evidence of all this and it wasn't just based on intuition.. There's a video on youtube about this but i think it might be too challenging...Peter wrote:Yip, to me they are belief systems and I dont want to be a part of them. When I express experiences and people tell me that they are deeply spiritual and so on I say not they are not. They are experiences and and that's all, I toss out belief systems like bad apples as fast as I can. Oh? is my ideal a belief system LOL
There's nothing wrong with believing or thinking that there's more out there than you've been told or having "extraordinary "experiences because i guarantee you there's someone out there who has had the same..It's pretty much like the 100th monkey experiment..somehow someone somewhere will always know something that you know and eventually you start hearing more of it or seeing it more frequently and you realize that more people are becoming aware of it or doing it. Isn't that what is happening now? It's like consciousness travels and many people are questioning reality whereas before everyone was stuck to their orthodox beliefs and views they were force-fed with growing up, pretty much like I was. it just shows you want to know more of something that you probably already knew or someone already knows and has published or yet to publish etc..it doesn't mean you're crazy or a freak..you shouldn't view spiritual experiences as "bad apples" but rather something you can learn from. Why would you put them in that category?? But it's up to you if you choose to not be a part of it since you are the captain steering the ship and no-one else.So basically, are all spiritual practices really just coping mechanisms to briefly escape reality?
I happen to think the most curious, most spiritual, most deep seeking/thinking people are some of the most interesting and intriguing people around since they tend to make the most discoveries, have the most significant influences and breakthroughs in their fields. There's Tesla with Tesla energy and his inventions which are now being investigated and expanded on by croatian scientists, Andrew Basiago and his teleportation experiments, there's Robert Monroe with the institute of OBEs and research, Reich with orgone energy, there's Bill Hicks who spoke about how life is just like a ride at an amusement park and how it's not "real", Bob Marley who always sang about legalizing marijuana and freeing our minds and cannabis has been known to have medicinal properties. There's Bruce Lee who was highly philosophical in everything he did and there's many others like Tupac, Michael jackson and so on and sadly they are all dead. Everyday someone makes a discovery or proposes something and many times they are shut down or called "Hippies", "fake" "conspiracy theorists", and so on. Quantum physicists have made discoveries about time and space being one and the same, there's been disclosure by ex-cia and other ex government officials and members about advanced technology etc. Many of these people have been influential in their fields and/or worldwide through and didn't they make a mark and question everything?? Many of them were highly respected and they may have been seen as "nutjobs" the moment they started questioning but all it was was that they just one day started to see things differently which actually accomplished something huge. I doubt they were highly irrational people. I doubt Bill Hicks, Geshe Kelsang Gyatso, George Carlin, Ghandi , Bob Marley, Martin Luther King, Bruce Lee and Michael Jackson lacked logical left brain functions when they spread the messages they did. You could say they lived more in the "right brain" intuitive way promoting peace, love, freethinking and freedom but they were also very smart which is associated with "left brain" side. Most have passed, but they did accomplish something great and heroic.They gave us a different perspective of life and reality as we know it.
There's nothing wrong with being religious either, but this is my path i chose since it is helping me and although it has often helped me to "cope" i feel that spirituality and other densities/dimensions and planes of existence do exist because there's things that that occur that we can't explain. I believe there's much more to know and just cos science hasn't disclosed it publicly does not mean it doesn't exist. I've learned more in the 5 years outside christianity than in the 11 years of a strict religious life. Also many of my questions have been answered. It's basically like previously being in a dark box with a tiny hole in and being exposed to seeing through that tiny hole for most of your life, but then you are freed from that box and you now find yourself looking from outside the box, able to see all the different dimensions, and everything else out there;pretty much like your consciousness and perspective expanding. Of course many of my views and previously held opinions were not only challenged by shattered and now I'm a very different person from who I used to be, and i dare say much better person. In some ways spirituality and "breaking free" from limitation has been a major source of comfort knowing that things do happen in the world for a reason and that we're constantly changing as beings on this planet.
At times i have often wanted to only be experiencing spiritual things and not be around materialism or mundane everyday things and often felt i couldn't cope with the stresses of life and it often made me depressed, since i find myself in some horrible situations and i felt like the harder i pushed away facing everyday without having a massive spiritual life changing lucid dream or OBE or even astral projection experience, the harder it was to have those experiences because I was depending too much on them and maybe limitting their function as a result or my ego get in the way. I realized that the day I didn't struggle as much or care as much to go through something spiritual to help me get on with the day, it just happened, freely. In other words i "flowed" with the flow of things. Maybe you should too. Maybe the two are not inseparable, and maybe everyday is some sort of spiritual experience. We could just be higher beings residing in a body, otherwise we wouldn't go to other states when we sleep at night (dreams)? People couldn't have NDEs or astral project if we were just solid bodies/machines with nothing else and all these unexplained spiritual phenomena like time travel and being able to travel through space. Believe it or not my greatest consolation comes from knowing that everything we're experiencing now is not going to last forever, and there's the possibility that reality may only be just a holographic projection of our minds;an illusion.
That's why we should have fun for the moment we have whether we choose to do it in materialistic things or in "Higher things" its your choice but I intend on living life based on my beliefs, and what resonates with me and i think that's fine too !!!
Nothing exists except atoms and empty space; everything else is opinion.