What are your religious views?

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What are your religious views?

Deeply religious - I follow a strict religious code and trust my life to a higher authority
22
19%
Somewhat religious - I believe in a higher intelligence watching over us
38
32%
Agnostic - I'm on the fence; you really can't say either way at this time
29
25%
Atheist - I don't believe there is a higher intelligence watching over us
29
25%
 
Total votes: 118

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Jack Reacher
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Jack Reacher » 17 Mar 2013 07:57

lucidinthe sky wrote:
Ryan wrote: What can I say... now I think differently. It works better for me... I feel it makes me a better person.
That's not to say it's a better way to think... it's to say that it's a better way to think for me. To each their own....


The important thing is that it makes your life more fullfilling and meaningful. That's what really matters. I believe that life is eternal and that gives me a lot of happiness.

I would be completely depressed if I believed that once we die, there is nothing. I can't even imagine that. We go into a hole in the ground or get incinerated but that's it, nothing after? I can't imagine believing that. What's the point of even living, life is so short. There's no way I'm going to believe that.


Well there is no point, its part of being an adult really, its something everyone deals with as you get older and you just move on. im curious, do you believe in religion because the story itself seems to make perfect sense, or because you can't live life as it is and have to have something else to make it worthwhile for yourself?

Most people who don't believe in God or the afterlive aren't completely depressed either.
"There is theoretical abstraction, and then there is true abstraction."

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erichsa
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby erichsa » 17 Mar 2013 21:56

lucidinthe wote
The important thing is that it makes your life more fullfilling and meaningful. That's what really matters. I believe that life is eternal and that gives me a lot of happiness.

I would be completely depressed if I believed that once we die, there is nothing. I can't even imagine that. We go into a hole in the ground or get incinerated but that's it, nothing after? I can't imagine believing that. What's the point of even living, life is so short. There's no way I'm going to believe that.


I am not Religious, but what a waste if that was all. I am not scared of dying, and dreaming helps me to understand that I am a particle of the universe. I find: Adventures Beyond The Body, by William Buhlman helps me to understand why we should be much more tolerant,and not to block our mind. It might go against what we at the moment think as the only truth, but we do only speak from our present knowlege. How often have you the reader changed you mind, by accepting new knowledge? In the middle age people were begining to doubt that the earth is a disk,and bit latter that the sun is going around the earth. I ask you "WHAT NEXT" :lol: What do you think will be our knowledge in 100 years? Have joy and fun :)

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Peter
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Peter » 18 Mar 2013 02:11

I have no idea if I will live after death and dont rely on it and have no dread or joy with either view. Its enough that something will exist even if it is without any selfish me invloved, a speck of dust or spark of energy. I really feel there is no purpose in life other than to live and use all of out senses and this is enough. Its a great freedom to simply accept this and just live
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

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taniaaust1
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby taniaaust1 » 18 Mar 2013 11:13

Summerlander wrote: What it boils down to is this: what if the recipient is just not feeling it? You will be forced to admit that, in certain situations, "unconditional love" is not the right solution. It will send certain individuals the wrong message in that, not matter how they behave, they will always be loved by others and therefore there is no reason to stop with the atrocities.


What's the use in giving people the impression that they don't have to make the effort and still be praised. To pander to their ego? To give them a chance to save face? It seems to discourage them from facing reality, doesn't it? Why encourage people not to change their erroneous ways? Unconditional love spoils people and gives monsters the perfect excuse to remain who they currently are.


Unconditional love does not mean no punishment for anyone. I'd like to point out that most parents do love their children unconditionally but most still believe a child should be punished if they do wrong.

Unconditional love isnt about people not being taught what they should and shouldnt do. Unconditional love doesnt mean that people should be allowed to do anything, it only means the person will love them no matter what they do.
The only thing to fear is the fear itself

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Summerlander
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Summerlander » 18 Mar 2013 13:41

lucidinthe sky wrote:
Ryan wrote: What can I say... now I think differently. It works better for me... I feel it makes me a better person.
That's not to say it's a better way to think... it's to say that it's a better way to think for me. To each their own....


The important thing is that it makes your life more fullfilling and meaningful. That's what really matters. I believe that life is eternal and that gives me a lot of happiness.

I would be completely depressed if I believed that once we die, there is nothing. I can't even imagine that. We go into a hole in the ground or get incinerated but that's it, nothing after? I can't imagine believing that. What's the point of even living, life is so short. There's no way I'm going to believe that.


This just proves my point. You guys are not concerned with the truth and don't care to know - especially if the truth proves to be uncomfortable. You will even deny it because you can't bear to think about it. This is also the reason why many religious people refuse to accept that God is a man-made concept. They got used to it for so long and they like the idea that someone is looking out for them that the thought of being alone is frightening and what they don't understand is ignored.

I'd rather know exactly what's going on based on what's evident - not faith and conjecture. To have faith is to believe without evidence. It is to give up on searching for the real answers and trusting a celestial being that you've never seen or heard which might as well be imaginary - a concept from the Dark Ages, a misguided, mistaken Gnosis held by people who knew so little at the time, people who thought the Earth was flat, stationary (according to biblical scripture) and the centre of the universe. It made them feel special, gave them comfort and pandered to their ego.

You believe for comfort. You believe in what, to you, is the most attractive (albeit infeasible) option because you do not wish to be depressed.

I, on the other hand, would rather face facts even if they seem harsh at first. A spiritual afterlife, a heaven or a hell are very improbable. All evidence (just look at how people can fade when their brains are ill) supports the notion that you die and that's it. I'm not depressed. I'm not here to delude myself just so I can be comfortable. I've learned to accept reality. Here lies real mental strength: acceptance. Not delusion or faith just so you're comfortable and have a sense of purpose.

The only philosophy, which is considered to be part of the religious circle, which really prepares you for what's coming is Buddhism. If Buddhism is right all the other religions are wrong. Buddhism helps you to accept and teaches you that wanting to become something can be a problem. Desire, indulgence and a refusal to let go is the real problem. The Buddhist, if he or she has followed his philosophy correctly, will be in a better state when faced with death than the adherents of other religions. Why? Because Buddhism teaches you to let go. It teaches you, with its meditation, to accept that you will lose everything in the end - including your sense of self. It does not make empty promises. It is only a shame that certain Buddhist factions today have coloured the Buddha's philosophy with mysticism and promise the good people rebirths in better realms for the good people - like rebirth is a truism. Where is the evidence that makes these monks so sure? They are suffering from the same condition that our ancestors were suffering: Dark Age nons... ahem... Gnosis. :mrgreen:

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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lucidinthe sky
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby lucidinthe sky » 18 Mar 2013 16:06

Summerlander wrote:The only philosophy, which is considered to be part of the religious circle, which really prepares you for what's coming is Buddhism. If Buddhism is right all the other religions are wrong. Buddhism helps you to accept and teaches you that wanting to become something can be a problem. Desire, indulgence and a refusal to let go is the real problem. The Buddhist, if he or she has followed his philosophy correctly, will be in a better state when faced with death than the adherents of other religions. Why? Because Buddhism teaches you to let go. It teaches you, with its meditation, to accept that you will lose everything in the end - including your sense of self. It does not make empty promises. It is only a shame that certain Buddhist factions today have coloured the Buddha's philosophy with mysticism and promise the good people rebirths in better realms for the good people - like rebirth is a truism. Where is the evidence that makes these monks so sure? They are suffering from the same condition that our ancestors were suffering: Dark Age nons... ahem... Gnosis.


But Buddhists believe in an afterlife and they can't prove it either. So much for Buddhism.

Buddhists also believe that our reality in the physical world is an illusion, much like a lucid dream (I think they are right about that) But this is completely non-scientific and quite the opposite of science. (as all religions).

I also believe in letting go of the physical world, but putting all your faith and belief in the physical world of this life is just the opposite. I don't see how only believing in the physical world helps prepare you for death, especially if there is an afterlife.

The main reason I believe in an afterlife is not because I'd be depressed otherwise, but that I just can't imagine my consciousness ceasing to exist. I couldn't believe in something that I thought was wrong just to make myself feel better. I really just can't believe in not continuing after this life. If some people consider me a weak little child for believing that, it's their problem, not mine.
Have you ever had a dream, Neo, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world? Morpheus

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Summerlander
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Summerlander » 18 Mar 2013 19:12

"I would be completely depressed if I believed that once we die, there is nothing."

Those were your exact words, buddy. :?
Or I am seeing things? :shock:

The Buddhists of today are mistaken and nearly three millennia have elapsed since the time of the Buddha. His story tells us that he was very much an agnostic, and he had every right to be one at that time. It is not hard to imagine that the Buddha, as curious as he was about nature, would be looking at science if he lived today. Sure, Tibetan Buddhism has deities and the belief in reincarnation. But that is a faction of 'modern' Buddhism.

Buddhism in its infancy was uncorrupted and there are a few followers today. Like I said before, acceptance of the way things are and what may come is what prepares you. It's not about belief, it is about being sure of what we already know and not welcoming infeasible fantasies like they're absolute truths.

The comparison they make between reality and lucid dreaming is none other than this - and this is also what science has already established: the 'mental clay' that we use to create a model of the external world that we perceive is the same one used for inventing other realities when we dream. During sleep, this brain mechanism is unconstrained by sensory input and is free to create whatever from the information that it already contains.

You can only perceive the world with what you got. Your organism. A fly or a lion will perceive it differently. Buddhism is also the only religion (although I don't really consider it to be one) that acknowledges this. No living creature can really see the external world exactly as it is - only their own mental model of it. That's how it works. That's why the world is like a lucid dream - because the interpretation of it also happens in our heads. What we see is a product of visual centres in our brain based on how the light frequencies that our eyes receive excite our cells and are converted into electrical impulses. :geek:

I just can't imagine my consciousness ceasing to exist. I couldn't believe in something that I thought was wrong just to make myself feel better. I really just can't believe in not continuing after this life.


Can you imagine being unconscious? Can you imagine any sort of experience in that state? No. And yet, it happens, and it happens when you are alive - you don't even have to be dead. Moreover, you are saying that you just can't believe in not continuing after this life... but what about the overwhelming evidence that strongly suggests otherwise? Just talk to someone who has a family member at the final stages of Alzheimer's or any other degenerative disease for that matter. See what dementia can do to people not to mention several types of brain damage.

Observe a split-brain patient and see how they behave and what they are aware of. Watch the mind be divided into two, quite literally! Also, consider that there is no evidence of a ghost or a humunculus controlling us. Hell, hypnosis can make a person forget who they are or make them susceptible to external suggestions. The mind is intrinsically empty (just meditate and see what you can achieve without even looking for it). There is nothing inside our heads but fleshy bits with great chemistry. You are a conglomerate of cells and nothing more. Once they all cease to function, you are no more. The illusion of "I" ceases to be. ;)

And why worry about ceasing to exist at death? There won't be a 'you' to know. You won't be aware of anything. There is no suffering. There is no pressure. I'd be more worried about lasting an eternity. Think about it... it would drive you mad. You would soon run out of things to do and think! You would bore yourself into insanity. Death is a blessing in disguise. :D
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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Worldenterer1
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Worldenterer1 » 19 Mar 2013 02:00

Summerlander wrote:And why worry about ceasing to exist at death? There won't be a 'you' to know. You won't be aware of anything. There is no suffering. There is no pressure. I'd be more worried about lasting an eternity. Think about it... it would drive you mad. You would soon run out of things to do and think! You would bore yourself into insanity. Death is a blessing in disguise. :D


“I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.”

― Mark Twain
Lucid Dream Count: 10
Normal Dream Count: 100+
Goal for next LD: Think with portals.

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erichsa
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby erichsa » 19 Mar 2013 19:46

“I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.”

― Mark Twain



Worldenterer1: I like it :)

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mikeg313
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Re: What are your religious views?

Postby mikeg313 » 20 Mar 2013 03:24

Similarly, I think we are dead before be are born. That is, we begin as free roaming spirits and get a chance to enter the physical world so that we can feel ( suffering,pain,happiness,etc.). When we die we return to our free roaming spirits until the next time possibly.

Its almost like a holiday, but for spirits. We ask the Higher Being ( a computer,God, The Devil,etc) Can we go and feel pain? I want to feel suffering. Then we book our flight to the physical world and we are born, because thats the only way to enter, from the soil only to return to the soil of the planet which every planet it is. Of course, we dont remember the spiritual world because we can not touch it ,small it or see it so therefore does not exist, but our dreams is like our postcards "Wish you were here."


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