how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

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kasi
Posts: 7
Joined: 18 Sep 2011 06:49

how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby kasi » 24 Sep 2011 07:31

when i attempt wild i experience s.p, vibrations,high pitch noise,floating etc iam observing the hypnogogia trying not to fall asleep or be draw into the images coming up ,then a scene opens up i try to will myself there and visualize myself there,which works, but it just stays as a visualization fantasy and dosnt become lucid,how should i progress from here.kasi

Snaggle
Posts: 590
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 13:08

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby Snaggle » 08 Oct 2011 19:23

“when i attempt wild i experience s.p, vibrations,high pitch noise,floating etc iam observing the hypnogogia trying not to fall asleep or be draw into the images coming up ,then a scene opens up i try to will myself there and visualize myself there,which works, but it just stays as a visualization fantasy and dosnt become lucid,how should i progress from here.kasi”-Kasi


Kasi you need to first consider what the normal sleep process is. I can certainly help you with this as I'm a natural WILDer and not the only member of my family that can do them naturally either; but I had to work for a few days to learn how to do them intentional. I likely have a better understanding of WILDing as I've been able to do them all my life.

Sleep is a process with stages that are normally gone through every night; though these stages sometimes happen together or out of order.

1. Waking Consciousness-with the conscious brain on, the subconscious brain off and the body on.

2. The conscious brain switches off. This stage is skipped if you're Wilding, as a Will involves unbroken consciousness through out the sleep process.

3. Light sleep-the subconscious brain switches on and one experiences weak/ static dreams. These can be of a single static object, a slide show or some very weak as in simple dynamic dream. This sleep is so light that if one opens ones eyes or moves ones body one will wake up fully and one can still hear real sounds; but may not be able to distinguish them from dream sounds. I think this is as far as you've really gotten in the dream process with your “vibrations,high pitch noise[s],floating[s] “ just being these weak dreams. Note: it's also possible to switch on the subconscious brain when normally awake, e.g. in Kung Fu (really Wu Shu) one really does see the flow of chi when doing it at a high enough level. Also, if you were really being trained in milam (Sanskrit Svapnadarsana) one would have first been trained in Osel (Sanskrit prabhasvara) usually called in English “clear light yoga”, which is essentially a conscious waking state void of any images or thought, one would have also been train in yidam yoga in which one learns to visualize as in really see ones yidam (a yidam is normally translated as “tutelary deity” but a better translation would be patron Buddha or Bodhisattva). Put another way you're like the kid who shows up to his sifu (kung fu master) expecting to do one inch punches in a couple of days or weeks rather than after several years of training in kung fu.

4. Sleep paralysis- the body switches off. This stage is hardly experienced at all, I see a waterfall or an almost instantly growing tree when this happens. I've also been in this stage without entering any sort of dream state, with my eyes wide open, able to move and my neck move a little without ending it. What happens is that electrical pulses flow rapidly throughout any part of the body lower than the head, from the base of the brain. Simply trying to move the body ended this state. There are no hallucinations or scary feelings as in the normally talked about nightmarish sleep paralysis.

5. Deep dream sleep-the dream become dynamic and when WILDing one momentarily thinks they're real until one has an “oh Duh” moment and knows what they are. These dreams differ only from light sleep dreaming in that they're complex and very dynamic like a motion picture. Both light dreams and deep dream can be vivid, as in virtual reality or more normal dreams. While WILDING one can have almost emotionless dreams with no more emotion than when normally awake; but the emotional experiences WILDING can also be much more intense than anything you've experienced when normally awake and one might not be able to control them as one can even in intense emotional states when awake.

6. Deep nightmare sleep- it's important for you to know that deep dreams are always followed by deep nightmares and these nightmare can be both vivid and emotionally intense. I've been killed several times in vivid dreams and experience both the wounds and death agonies, I've also been tortured and tortured to death vivid nightmares. In light sleep intense emotion normally wakes one up fully; but in deep sleep it's abnormal to be woken up by them. If you do WILDing often enough you'll both be taken to heaven and hell.

7. The body switches back on, there are normally no dream images associated with this state and it's the least likely stage for you to experience.

8. Light sleep dreaming. One can wake up if one tries from this state at will or be pulled out of it by any strong emotion. If one does dream return after waking up, one will normally return to this state and more rarely will return to deep dreams/nightmares without sleep paralysis.

9. Normal waking up with the conscious mind on, the subconscious mind off and the body on.

REASONS NOT TO WILD:

1. One can skip stages and have an hallucination. One may think that one has been visited by Jesus or other supernatural being or been attacked by a preternatural or demonic being, so you might become someone like Mohamed who had a waking dream and thought he was a prophet.

2. You'll experience vivid nightmares and hellish emotions beyond anything you've experienced in normal life and if emotionally unstable or maybe even if just normal might be emotionally traumatized by what you experienced.

3. You could experience sleepwalking; though his never happened to me when I was Wilding every night for two years, it is certainly possible.

4. Something no one else has talked about, I normally sleep 4 hours and have gotten by for a few years on just two hours of sleep; but when WILDing I was sleeping 6-8 hours a day, so Wilding is less restful and restorative than normal sleep.

6. Sleep paralysis of the classic nightmarish kind. I've never experienced this; but I think the people who have are having an abnormal mixed state in which they're experiencing deep sleep nightmare and waking up mixed with sleep paralysis; but they really could be being attacked by demons. It's always a bad idea to jump from an opinion into a conclusion, staying skeptical or open minded is always the best approach.

7. False awakenings can be so vivid that one starts to take seriously that all life is an illusion.

8. If you do WILDING constantly the dreams and nightmares are often boring.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

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Peter
Posts: 1951
Joined: 26 May 2011 08:02
Location: New Zealand

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby Peter » 09 Oct 2011 00:31

great post. I am familar with most of what you describe and would have started many cults due to "visions" if I did not question so much.

What was the trigger for a WILD compared to letting them happen by themselves.

Peter
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

kasi
Posts: 7
Joined: 18 Sep 2011 06:49

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby kasi » 09 Oct 2011 07:58

thankyou snaggle for your replie...happy dreams...kasi

Snaggle
Posts: 590
Joined: 02 Oct 2011 13:08

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby Snaggle » 13 Oct 2011 01:57

Peter wrote:
What was the trigger for a WILD compared to letting them happen by themselves.

Peter


Peter when one normally false asleep ones eyes are completely relaxed and one becomes drowsy and nods off; when I had been WILDing naturally my eyes were closed but not relaxed, there's also something different that I do besides this, that feels like a subtilely different than just keeping my eyes alert, maybe I'm altering my brainwaves.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

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Peter
Posts: 1951
Joined: 26 May 2011 08:02
Location: New Zealand

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby Peter » 13 Oct 2011 02:15

If my experance is close or the same I say there are 3 states of vision, eyes open in normal life, eyes closed shut and tight and eyes closed but relaxed - looking at your eyelids. Thats about how I would describe it and its the looking at my lids that is when the starbursts or other visual clues come that tell me I am on the verge of entering a dream.

There is a point where I feel like I am falling into a calm space, observing my brainwaves or some such thing. Its a calmness that also has a limitless space associated with it. Hard to get exact words but keen to get you views on how it happens for you

Peter
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

kasi
Posts: 7
Joined: 18 Sep 2011 06:49

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby kasi » 13 Oct 2011 07:55

hello again peter ,thanks for sharing that .my experience as a beginner attempting wild is i am laying still doing a breathing exercise relaxing mentaly each part of my body from toes to head,at the same time iam internaly reciting to myself that the next time iam dreaming i will recognise that iam dreaming,iam observing the blackness slowly images appear,as the breathing exercise continues i get a sense of floating ,s.p starts to take over,electrical currents start running throughout my body,images are turning into dreamlets fantasys and fantasys start slipping into full dream sequences iam awake observing it and on the point of falling asleep, iam trying to relax and stay awake observing the dream sequences at a certain point where the dream sequences are becoming very vivid i attempt to exit the hypnogogia expecting the dream that iam obseving to become 3d i try being there in the dream imagining participating in it to help induce lucidity ,but it just stays as a non lucid dream and feels so close to lucidty but trillions off miles away and i fall asleep ,this is my experience with w.i.l.d so far i need help with moving into the dream that iam observing and the dream becoming lucid...happy dreams..kasi

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Peter
Posts: 1951
Joined: 26 May 2011 08:02
Location: New Zealand

Re: how do i cross from the hypnogogia to lucidity w.i.l.d

Postby Peter » 13 Oct 2011 08:51

Just keep practising and if you get a good sleep instead of a LD be grateful. It will all click in time, what is not posted and may only be my experience is that it will not happen all the time and even experienced LDreamers will have dry runs.
I can recall 6 or 8 dreams on a very good night and almost without exception will recall 3 or 4 but do have times when I just sleep and don’t remember a thing. I also have dry runs and won’t have a LD for a few weeks at a time.

Peter
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born


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