Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Tell us about your first lucid dream - and your latest. We want all the juicy details. Also share results of dream challenge experiments.
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Summerlander
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Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 05 Nov 2013 23:51

Hi, I have been thinking about some of the subjects that have been posted lately such as shared/mutual dreaming, out-of-body experiences and intriguing lucid dreams so I decided to go through my journal and I found this old experience...

Visiting Mike - 09/07/2010:
Phase State = Lucid Dreaming; Out-of-body Experiences; Astral Projection

I woke up briefly around 3.50am and lay on my side. I remember thinking that perhaps I was too close to the edge of the bed and could fall off. Progressive relaxation led to my body feeling heavy. Suddenly, I heard a pulsing hiss in my head which gradually increased its frequency. I wondered if this heralded the approach of the REM stage which I was about to consciously enter. Was I experiencing the conscious feedback of my own brain waves, getting faster in rhythm, or was the hissing completely unrelated? No way to tell. A pervading energy flowing from my head made me feel warm and tingly, the hissing getting faster and louder. Eventually, the sensation turned teasingly electrical. The hissing slowed down but showed no signs of stopping as it became steady. Violent vibrations ensued and made me think that I might fall off the bed so I decided to roll over and stand.

I could feel a solid floor beneath my feet but was completely blind. I thought I’d better do something about vision lest I bumped into something. Sight manifested gradually but not to its full potential. It was like seeing through a dark but extremely thin sheet. I could make out my sleeping body lying in bed and Stacey lying next to me. I glided out of the bedroom and into the hallway where I peered into the kids rooms. They were too dark for me to see anything. The hallway light was the only one that was on. I glided back to my room and had the idea of visiting my friend Mike who lives across town. Excitedly, I plunged into a wall and emerged outdoors.

I ascended towards the night sky and flew high above houses. I could hear the wind and voices that sounded like a group of people engaged in conversation and laughter below me. I thought of Mike again and had a strong desire to get to him as quickly as possible. A wormhole materialised in the sky in front of me, and, before entering it, I could see it stretching across the sky in an arch, like a huge semi-transparent snake leading to a different location. I travelled at great speed through the wormhole and its see-through walls enabled me to make out the night sky and a dark mass of land adorned with city lights below. When I finally reached my destination, I was somewhere that resembled Mike's place. I'm pretty sure that his living room was different.

Mike walked in, at which point, I hovered near the ceiling with excitement and ready to observe. He was looking around anxiously, as though he could sense my presence in the room. His expression was that of someone who senses an invisible presence. He look up, but never at me, as I hovered in circles near the ceiling. I decided to switch his TV on (success, but couldn’t tell what was on) to see how Mike would react. However, when I looked him, he was holding the remote control and nonchalantly pointing it at the screen, thence, it could be interpreted that he was the one who had turned the telly on.

I shifted my attention to the walls and noticed an object that looked like a calendar at first, but, on closer inspection, it revealed a red devil character as part of some sort of illustration. I took it from the wall and discovered the following (fuzzy at first, and then clear) inscription: “The devil controls realities.” I found that odd and hung the picture back on the wall. When I looked around, the house had transmogrified into an unfamiliar environment and Mike had vanished. I dashed up a staircase in this new environment and found empty rooms. “Where am I?” - I thought.

Suddenly, everything went completely dark and I remember a falling sensation prior to regaining physical awareness. I looked at the clock. It was 5.10am. I couldn’t help but wonder if I had visited Mike in his house and the real world having perhaps been subjectively distorted by my discarnate presence. Maybe I had inadvertently invaded his mind! Or was it all in my mind? There was one way I could possibly find out so I sent him an email. The wormhole was a surprise but coincided with my wish to reach my destination: Mike. I have been to his house before (physically) and he is a very good friend of mine.

He phoned me about this experience just before I caught a train to Cornwall for my holiday. The line connection was bad but it seems that Mike was able to confirm some things about this experience to be true. He told me he usually lies in bed and listens to music in his bedroom, but, on that particular night he stayed up watching TV. Coincidence or what? He did not feel any presence at the time, but, when he went to sleep, he dreamt about an unseen presence. He woke up that morning and told his partner that he felt as though he was supposed to remember someone or something. Also, the devil picture and “the devil controls realities” ties in with what’s been on his mind lately. He’s been reading about Buddhism and was intrigued by the story where Buddha faces a tempting Mara, the lord of illusions, which also represents the “devil” in all of us. The Wheel of Life in Buddhism and the symbolic concept that a devil control realities had also been on Mike’s mind at the time.

The nature of my experience remains uncertain but it is also worth noting that I have also read about Buddhism prior to this, which, of course, warrants my unflagging scepticism. Nevertheless, I set out to enter the phase state again and revisit my friend in a bid to experiment with this possibility.


And I did! Stay tuned for the "Revisit" and what Mike had to say about it! ;)
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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HAGART
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby HAGART » 06 Nov 2013 20:38

I'm tuned and won't touch the dial.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Summerlander
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 06 Nov 2013 20:42

LOL!

Cool! The "Revisiting Mike" one happened about ten days later, I think, I'll definitely post it here when I have time. :D
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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Summerlander
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 13 Nov 2013 23:08

Revisiting Mike - 20/07/2010:

"I woke up in the early hours of the morning and did not move. Briefly, I opened my eyes to see sunlight oozing through the blinds. I shut my eyes again and reached a mild form of sleep paralysis in a short space of time. Hissing pulsed in my head, irregular at first, but then, it developed a constant rhythm and grew louder to the point where I could hear constant sparkling. An overwhelming warmth took over me. By now I was hearing a mixture of weird sounds, the most prominent one being that of something like ocean waves or bursts of wind. As this went on, I felt a force shooting up and down my body and with my mind I purposely (and playfully I might add) smoothed this sensation out - why not! Eventually I realised it would be okay to attempt separation. Because I lay on my stomach, separation involved rising up and away from my body at a 90-degree angle, and the tips of my toes acted as hinges for such impossible move. I don't know how I did it but I know that a conscious decision to separate had been made.

I could feel the bed beneath my feet but my vision was smudged. I could see that, behind the dark stains in my visional scope, detail was impeccable. I moved around, partially blind, and glided to the hallway outside my bedroom. I wished for the partial blindness to go away and felt someone else’s hands rubbing my eyes. I was sure there was a presence behind me and froze, not knowing exactly what to do. The hands removed themselves and I could see clearly. I looked around and saw no one. Peering into the other rooms revealed my sleeping children, but they didn't look right as they seemed to be made of wax. I felt a desire to explore outside the house and shot up through the roof. The sky was blue and I found myself above clouds. I wished to descend, as I felt that I had gone a little too high, and, suddenly, teleportation to a reasonable height occurred. My new perceived position in the celestial space of the phase enabled me to see rooftops and power lines below. Some clouds were found at an unrealistically low altitude, which made the scenery look somewhat misplaced. As I hovered in the air, I thought that it would be a great idea to visit Mike again. I started to gradually spin and picked a direction to plunge into. (I usually do this now as I am quite confident that it will get me to places but on this occasion I remember that perhaps I had rushed it a little.)

I travelled like a rocket through a dark void, spread my arms, and felt a slight resistance or friction as though I travelled underwater. Then, I recalled that it was imperative to resume focus on my destination (Mike) lest stray thinking led me to an undesired random location. The thought of stopping the motion through the void crossed my mind, but the decision to continue until I came to a halt willy-nilly seemed to be more appropriate at the time. I travelled for ages in darkness and began to inexplicably bend my torso into a “U” shape which caused me to fly up and reflexively jump into a tranquil scene. I possessed formidable visual clarity and the phase environment would have been indistinguishable from the real world if not for its splendorous, unnatural brightness. It wasn’t anything like Mike’s house, by the way, and the contours of its objects were sharp.

As I explored this strange house, I discovered a curious blue room where Mike sat on the floor with a couple of CD cases and an object looking like a cross between a CD folder and laptop. There was also a parallelogram-shaped stereo near him, and, in the middle of the room and away from him, another rounder and reddish version rested on a beige floor. I approached him and asked if he could see me (in the last phase experience his presence had seemed unable to fixate his eyes on me). He looked up and nodded. Thinking about the possibility that I could be really communicating (“telepathically”) with the real deal (or at least a subconscious aspect of the real Mike), I told him to remember me and he said he would do his best. He proceeded to express his frustration at not being able to have an OOBE so far. In a consolatory tone, I surmised to him that he may already be “out-of-body” and the difference between me and him being that I was conscious he wasn't. He asked me if I felt light but I don’t recall my reply. We talked some more but things are mnemonically hazy at this point.

The environment transmuted and the experience became more dreamlike. I recall thinking that my mission had been accomplished just before I was back in my sleeping body. I could feel the bed beneath me but I didn't move. Ephemeral vibrations ensued, and, once gone, I got up and went to the bathroom to wash my face. The curious presence of a mirror above the sink, which is non-existent in waking life, made me realise I hadn’t quite got out of bed. I had re-entered the phase state. I briefly lost myself in thoughts about the shocking revelation that the act of getting up and using the bathroom had not been real and lost sight of what was around me. When I shifted my attention to the surroundings again, I was in a caravan, still standing in front of a mirror. (My mother owns a caravan but the one in this phase experience looked different.)

My reflection was perfect but I could see my mother standing behind me, looking younger, and staring at the mirror seemingly in despair. I turned around but there was nobody behind me. I looked back at the mirror and her reflection was still there. I had a strong feeling that she was in trouble so I flew upwards and set out to look for her. As I flew up, I felt some resistance going through the ceiling of the caravan. It seemed to melt around me and felt like glue until I broke free and continued to ascend away from the broken vehicle. There was a park outside, the trees and the grass were pleasant to look at but I was determined to find my mother as I was convinced that she was in trouble in the real world and believed her mind could be accessed in the phase. At this point, the doubting Thomas in me was nonexistent.

I landed in a warehouse where lots of people were talking excitedly about a race. They were drinking, eating, and seemed to be having a good time in general. None of them took any notice of me and I didn’t have any desire to speak to them. My attention focused on an Afro-man who had a great smile and seemed very happy. In a Jamaican accent, he euphoniously referred to the race as being “so good and about to be so much fun.” I started to feel like an observer rather than a participant. People left the warehouse and entered vehicles lined up outside. I followed the Afro-man whose happiness was inspirational and refreshing. There was a bang like the firing of a gun once everyone was in their cars. The race started. Several racers were overtaking the Afro-man and it seemed hopeless that he could ever win the race.

He didn’t seem to care about losing and maintained his mirthful smile. It seemed like nothing could bother that man as he sung about the race being fun! At one point he closed his eyes, danced in his vehicle, and bumped into a fellow racer in front of him. I observed the race whilst hovering over the Afro-man’s vehicle, synching with its speed, occasionally flying next to it but always a few feet higher - which enabled me to see the track ahead and the other racers. I didn't care that he was losing the race, all I cared about was observing his happiness. The scene gradually faded and fouled. This time I got up for real and it was time to take my son to school.

Later, when I picked up my son from school, my mother phoned me and asked if I called her on her mobile as she thought she had seen my number come up on her screen. I told her I hadn’t after checking my mobile to make sure that it hadn’t been done by accident. I asked her if she was okay as I thought that she sounded a bit vague and was glad to hear that she was alright. (In a spooky twist that almost alludes to prophetic phase experience on my part, I later discovered that my mother wasn’t really happy in her relationship and was having problems with the caravan.)

I emailed my experience to Mike and waited for his reply. He phoned me to confirm that what I saw him do in my OOBE coincided with what he was doing that morning. Because he has been reading about Buddhism and was inspired by it, he was getting rid of a great portion of his music collection while sitting on the floor in a meditative position. He was feeling good about getting rid of some of his possessions. He knows he doesn’t have to do this but it brings him great comfort to know that he can live in peace without his precious possessions. He also asked me if the walls of the room I found him in were sky blue. This is something I had not mentioned in the email and indeed they were! It made sense to him because he associates blue with peace and calm, something he was experiencing at the time.

In fact, my experience seemed to make more sense to him than me. What an astounding coincidence, again, which makes an eldritch experience out of my “revisit.” However, Mike doesn’t remember having had a conversation with me in a dream or otherwise. Not even a funny mnemonic feeling like the one he reported after my first phase state visit. Eerily enough though, both occasions seem to capture the gist of what was on his mind at the time, and, coincidentally, the gist of waking life actions, too.

On the other hand, one cannot rule out more mundane explanations besides some form of phase state telepathy. Besides fluky hits there is always the subconscious mind. Perhaps that part of my mind made a wild guess, or retrieved some information subconsciously perceived (especially concerning my mother), or could have even worked out the most probable scenarios based on readily available information about the subjects. The mundane explanation could still be that on those occasions my intuition was working superbly. Whatever the case, I am definitely planning to experiment further with “visiting” individuals in the phase and making more observations."


THE PHASE or PHASE STATE = A hybrid state of mind that compounds waking consciousness and vivid (often hyper-realistic) dreaming, in essence, encompassing out-of-body sensations and lucid dreaming.
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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HAGART
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby HAGART » 16 Nov 2013 01:14

It's possible that our subconscious picks up on emotional cues that we are not aware of. There's something called, 'microexpressions', in which someone has a fleeting expression which can reveal a lot about what they are feeling or thinking. Although consciously we are not always aware of them, perhaps subconsciously we are, and it knows how others feel.

There are some other scientific theories and tests which claim to prove that we are all connected and share thoughts and feelings. One guy said it was possible because our brains operate at the same Hertz as the Earth's magnetic field, so our thoughts can be carried through it like a wave. It's just a matter of picking up on those waves and interpreting that information. There was someone else who apparently synchronized his brain wave pattern with someones else's and could tap into their memories. And on Conan (yes Conan again, that's where I get my news...) a guy said that we actually exude our emotional energy into the area around us which is why when you walk into a room you can 'sense the vibe'. Apparently it was measurable.
(I don't know the details of all this, but many people have actually tried to study it scientifically.)

One thing I've noticed with many telepathic experiences I've heard about is that it tends to be a strong emotion between two loved ones. And almost always a negative one too for some reason. I don't know why that is. Coincidence... wishful thinking? People would always love to have a 6th sense about when a loved one is in trouble.

About remote viewing:
I think I'd have an easier chance reading someone's emotions in the phase state, than reading a playing card. It makes sense since, during a dream state, our Amygdala, which is linked to emotions, is hyper-active. If remote viewing is possible at all perhaps others' emotions are 'viewable' or perceivable in some way. The hard part is getting them to verify it.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Summerlander
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 17 Nov 2013 12:36

You're right. Getting people to verify it is the hard part. You need to have someone you can trust and not one who will lie about hits or misses.

The micro-expressions theory could apply to my mother but when it comes to Mike's case, it doesn't seem to do. As for "telepathy" or mind entanglement within the geomagnetic field, it could be true, but perhaps rare. Perhaps only a few of our lucid dreams will be of that kind. It could indeed warrant perceiving the gist of what's on other's minds, to remote view minds enabled by some natural 'spooky action at a distance.' My mother and Mike live on the other side of town.

I once frequented the now extinct Astral Viewers website and visited Cait, one of the Admin. She also had made some associations and my OOBE made more sense to her than me. I seemed to have got info that could not possibly have come across anywhere. Must find that one too and post it here.

Have you heard of Michael Persinger?

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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HAGART
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby HAGART » 17 Nov 2013 20:35

Summerlander wrote:Have you heard of Michael Persinger?


I just looked him up, and it turns out, I do know him.
I saw a lecture of his on You Tube and he was the one who proposed the idea that we transmit our thoughts through the geomagnetic field. (That's where I learned it from, but I didn't know his name at the time).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9l6VPpDublg
This is what I watched: "Michael Persinger on No More Secrets".
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Summerlander
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 18 Nov 2013 00:23

Yes, the prof with the "God Helmet" and I saw that video too. He surprised everyone because he is the sort of person who would have scoffed at the idea of telepathy, psychics and any other phenomena that remotely resembles what is propounded by parapsychology. With Persinger, it didn't get more materialistic than that.

Either he genuinely believes he is onto something or he's had a change of heart to the point of condoning a little chicanery from his peers. I've heard he's recently had visits from other renowned scientists who found no clear evidence of "macro-entanglement."

I'm on the fence when it comes to this. Consciousness is elusive enough, but quantum entangled conscious minds? I need time to catch my breath! Lol!

Still, given some of my experiences with lucid dreaming, I'd be a hypocrite, and a dishonest one at that, if I just dismissed the idea altogether. It would be a disservice to humankind.

The question is: Are we biologically capable of generating a smidgeon of a "mindnet" or do we require high-tech (matrix like) machines to enable that?

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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HAGART
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby HAGART » 18 Nov 2013 02:23

If our minds could do it, a machine certainly can.
Then it would be proven and can be replicated. Anyone could observe it and it would not be a theory, but a fact.

The problem with lucid dreams is that there is only one observer and an unreliable one. I must admit, I don't think clearly in a lucid dream no matter how lucid-minded I think I am. And whatever I report is my own interpretation and there is no unbiased 3rd party to experience what I do and observe it objectively.

If there's any truth to what Persinger proposes then a machine could read minds, and prove it. It just needs to sense the right patterns from a specific mind, amongst the noise of others and natural interference, and translate them to give them meaning. It would be an amazing breakthrough, right up there with the telephone and the television. They too, take patterns (waves, currents) and translate them don't they? And they too would have been considered magic or paranormal before they were invented.

I don't know if I'd want such a device to exist though. Having no privacy would drive me crazy! Poker wouldn't be fun any more either! 8-)
Then again, there would be no more secrets and only those with things to hide, and who manipulate people, are the ones who should worry. (There's lots of people like that in this world. They call themselves, Politicians ;) ). Until then, we should all use our own internal "B.S. Meter". It's actually quite reliable if people chose to turn it on.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Summerlander
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Re: Visiting People in OBE/LD and Verification

Postby Summerlander » 18 Nov 2013 02:44

There is something dark about "no more secrets." It seems to be something that belongs to a Big Brother society. I believe everyone has secrets they would like to keep hidden. A society where there are no more secrets would inevitably be a dystopic one, even if its government did not criticise, condemn or punish that in people which is inevitable and blameless in the first place. People would hate it if secretive material, especially of the sexual nature, was exposed. It would be a gross invasion of privacy (although some individuals should have this right countermanded for the safety of others).

Perhaps I was being naive at the time, but, before "visiting" anyone (real) in my lucid dreams, I have always asked if they were okay with it. Just in case...

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava


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