Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

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rallynochaos
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Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby rallynochaos » 09 Apr 2014 10:07

I figured I'd share this here because it's semi relevant to sleep and I've never got any opinions before on the subject.

Most my youth I had problems falling asleep - my mind tends to stay very act and I can't keep it quiet long enough to fall asleep. Many years ago, as a desperate 12-year-old, I read on the internet methods of calming the mind through self-hypnosis. It was pretty much just a combination of counting down in your head, telling your body what it will do at certain numbers, controlling your breathing, and tightening and loosening the muscles at different points in the countdown.

One night as I got to the end of the process, I drifted about six feet below my body. As in my body was clearly laying above me. What was also really weird was I had the CD player on low in the background (because my 12-year-old self for some reason thought music could also help me sleep) and I could hear the music while below my body - except I was hearing it through my body above me. As in the music was traveling from the boombox, to my body, and down to me. This wasn't a dream, I was definitely awake through the process, and after just kinda hanging out below my body for a while I floated back up and "re-entered" my body.

Anyone else have any similar experiences? I used to always see this in Ninja movies while they meditated - but they always went above their body into a cloudy space instead of down into darkness.

Snaggle
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby Snaggle » 10 Apr 2014 09:40

Rallynochaos OBE are very common, as in 10-25% of the general population have had them and they're even more common amongst lucid dreamers. My opinion may surprise you, but I don't think that the majority of inexperienced lucid dreamers or non-lucid dreamers can tell whether they're awake or not.

Even though OBE do occur while people are awake, they also occur in dreams, when they're clearly asleep. I think you were asleep because you had a clear dreamsign in your OBE.

What was also really weird was I had the CD player on low in the background (because my 12-year-old self for some reason thought music could also help me sleep) and I could hear the music while below my body - except I was hearing it through my body above me. As in the music was traveling from the boombox, to my body, and down to me.


Having unbroken consciousness or having a dream occur in a real world setting and where your real body is, is actually commonplace.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

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Summerlander
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby Summerlander » 10 Apr 2014 10:14

If you have an OOBE, sorry to say this, but, you are either dreaming (sleep hallucination) or hallucinating if awake. There is no such thing as leaving the body for real. Such sensation is always illusory and the product of the mind.

Now, I would contend that lucid dreamers manage the more advanced form of the phenomenon. What I mean by this is that a lucid dream is superior to an ostensible OOBE by definition as the sleeper recognises the environment for what it really is: a dream.

Here's an analogy: the schizophrenic may hallucinate and be completely swayed by delusion. The psilocybin user may lucidly enjoy what appears to be reality distortions knowing fully well that he hallucinates. Lucid dreaming is analogous to the latter, OOBEs tend to be analogous to the former especially when practitioners hold New Age or Spiritualistic beliefs - even the agnostics can fall for the illusion.

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Snaggle
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby Snaggle » 10 Apr 2014 11:43

Summerlander wrote:If you have an OOBE, sorry to say this, but, you are either dreaming (sleep hallucination) or hallucinating if awake. There is no such thing as leaving the body for real. Such sensation is always illusory and the product of the mind.

Now, I would contend that lucid dreamers manage the more advanced form of the phenomenon. What I mean by this is that a lucid dream is superior to an ostensible OOBE by definition as the sleeper recognises the environment for what it really is: a dream.

Here's an analogy: the schizophrenic may hallucinate and be completely swayed by delusion. The psilocybin user may lucidly enjoy what appears to be reality distortions knowing fully well that he hallucinates. Lucid dreaming is analogous to the latter, OOBEs tend to be analogous to the former especially when practitioners hold New Age or Spiritualistic beliefs - even the agnostics can fall for the illusion.

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Not enough evidence to confirm this one way or the other, but the results of the Aware study support you Summerland, as none of the subjects identified the images beyond their range of sight during their Near Death Experiences during cartiac arrest. For those using NDE as proof of OBE or the existence of a spirit this was a major blow the same for ESP supporters including Remote Viewers/Clairvoyants.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

jasmine2
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby jasmine2 » 12 Apr 2014 00:51

I've only had a few lucid dreams and a few out-of-body experiences. I'm not picky. I think either "flavor" of "conscious journeying" experience is tremendously interesting.

In Robert Waggoner's book "Lucid Dreaming : Gateway To The Inner Self", Chapter 3 - "Moving In Mental Space" provides many interesting insights. Waggoner says it is often easy to confuse lucid dreaming and OBEs. A vivid dream memory of flying around a tree in your yard could be either a LD or OBE. He lists 6 distinctions between these two categories of experience, but he says the most common difference is that lucid dreamers often have the ability to change their dream environment, to a certain degree, whereas, people experiencing OBEs do not report consciously changing their dream environment.

Also, Waggoner ponders "Does space exit only in the mind?" ... "Do you actually venture through space, or would it be more correct to say you venture through ideas, intents, and beliefs exteriorized? Is the movement of consciousness the only movement?" (p.37)

I recommend the following good books about out-of-body experiences. -

- "Journeys Out Of The Body" by Robert Monroe

- "Adventures Beyond The Body" by William Buhlman

- "Astral Dynamics - A New Approach To Out-Of-Body Experience" by Robert Bruce

- Also, there are many videos on YouTube featuring the above mentioned authors.

jasmine2

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taniaaust1
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby taniaaust1 » 12 Apr 2014 13:45

That's a tough question to ask a LD group as many here believe lucid dreams and OBES are the same thing. I myself dont thou and experience these two things differently (thou at times one can have both going on so it doesnt have to be experiencing from just one or the other either).

Yes Ive had some very interesting OBES. In an OBE I can interact with our real world eg once while floatin up by my ceiling, I saw a gift voucher my boyfriend had hidden on the top of my wardrobe which he hadnt told me about. I was actually able to read it!! where it was too and the amount for. (boyfriend was annoyed at me as he wouldnt believe I saw it in an OBE and accused me of spying on him while he was hiding it). Ive had other interaction with real life experiences too during OBEs.

LDs thou are when the subconcious mind is making something up.

Your experience sounds like an OBE.

rallynochaos.. if you want to learn OBE I suggest going to an OBE site instead of a LD website. With OBES one doesnt want the subconsciousness manifesting as otherwise it becomes a dream. There is a slightly different state involved for a clear OBE and I find its near impossible to be working on LD states and then expect to be having OBES (as then I end up in mixed LD states which may have slight astral awareness too but the dream state will contaminate an OBE so you then cant trust that what you are experiencing is real).

With one you need your mind very clear and no dreaming coming in, with the other you need to let your mind go in such a way in which you start dreaming. Very slight differences (both of cause need the same kind of body relaxation state) but the mind difference will alter which you are doing. (hence its hard to do one and then be trying to do the other, I find thou that people seem to be more intune with either LD or AP depending on which brain state they find easier. Some will start to try to LD and end up starting to go into OBE state instead).

Once you work with one of these states, it like becomes a habit (and is very difficult then to go and do the other state just like that, your brain will want to do what its used to be doing as its a real shift to change). I nowdays dont tend to have OBEs cause Ive been focused on LD for while.
Last edited by taniaaust1 on 12 Apr 2014 14:04, edited 4 times in total.
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taniaaust1
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby taniaaust1 » 12 Apr 2014 13:50

Snaggle wrote: I think you were asleep because you had a clear dreamsign in your OBE.


That's one thing I look for too which can help one tell if another was dreaming at least some, I cant see the dream sign thou you are refering too. Please share what you are thinking is a dream sign with this one? Where the radio was in relation to his projected body? (that does make OBE sense to me, I experience physical things in relation to where my astral body is.. the point of consciousness has appropriately changed location) .. or have I missed something?
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Snaggle
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby Snaggle » 13 Apr 2014 05:46

Tania

What was also really weird was I had the CD player on low in the background (because my 12-year-old self for some reason thought music could also help me sleep) and I could hear the music while below my body - except I was hearing it through my body above me. As in the music was traveling from the boombox, to my body, and down to me.


Summerland would say that being out of your body is a clear dreamsign ;). I take a neutral view on whether or not real OBE exist or not, but tend to think those happening during dreams and when people are trying to sleep are dreams and certainly some and maybe all OBE are a subtype of dreams. The music traveling to his body and then down to his "double"/Ka or whatever (as he did not describe whether or not he still at a body and if so what kind) is a fairly strong dreamsign, as even out of body one's physical body is not a "PC" wirelessly transmitting to ones out of body self.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

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nawick
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby nawick » 07 Aug 2014 17:08

The most obvious way to tell if it is a dream or not is by the contrast. When you go from not feeling your body to feeling your body again, you will notice it.
If you re-enter and you can hear the blood flowing in your veins and feel the hair on your arms against your skin, then you know it wasnt a dream.
"If you believe that you can or if you believe that you can't - you are right." - Henry Ford.

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Summerlander
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Re: Anyone ever have an out-of-body experience?

Postby Summerlander » 07 Aug 2014 20:20

How can you trust that sort of perception when the dreaming mind can emulate any sensation and give the illusion of reality? Real OOBEs (ie really being out of the body) don't exist. Snaggle is dreaming. The OOBEs we experience are illusions, just dreams produced by the kind of phase state of the brain (40 hz gamma) that is also responsible for lucid dreaming.

The difference between OOBEs and lucid dreams is that in the latter the individual recognizes the true nature of his surroundings (that of a dream) as opposed to the former where he is overcome with delusion (duped by the mental milieu). :-)

Give up the ghost! Literally... :-D

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava


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