JFK Assassination

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Who Killed Kennedy?

I agree with the official verdict: Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone
1
13%
The CIA and/or FBI (with or without Oswald being an accomplice or a scapegoat)
0
No votes
The Mafia (feeling betrayed and affected with deportation by the Kennedys
0
No votes
Anti-Castro Cuban groups (feeling abandoned and betrayed by the US government)
0
No votes
Lyndon B Johnson (having felt embarrassed (vice presidency) by the Kennedy campaign
0
No votes
The Secret Service (for whatever reason that we are not aware of)
0
No votes
The Communists (Cuba and/or the Soviet Union)
0
No votes
A Coalition of some or all of the above potential conspirators
3
38%
A Shadow Government, eg. the Illuminati, Zionists
1
13%
Other (please specify)
3
38%
 
Total votes: 8

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Summerlander
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JFK Assassination

Postby Summerlander » 23 May 2014 19:18

Recently, I watched "Shooter" (starring Mark Wahlberg) with my wife. It was a great movie and it prompted me to review the JFK assassination. 8-)

Not too long ago, I covered the Bay of Pigs fiasco which led to the Cuban Missile Crisis. Kennedy had inherited the problematic rise of Cuban socialism from Eisenhower, something which had also affected the Coca-Cola franchise business his father had there during the Batista regime. (It has to be pointed out that, despite J Edgar Hoover having been cast as one of the suspects in the JFK assassination by conspiracy theorists, the FBI director did admire old Joe Kennedy for being a capitalist and an anti-communist - however, he did not feel the same way about his son.) :|

Anyway, I don't want to mention too much too soon, because, after all, this is supposed to be a poll. So, I would just like to ask, for now, who you think is responsible for the assassination of John F Kennedy. It is said that modern forensic evidence strongly suggests that Lee Harvey Oswald was the assassin. However, one is also prompted to ask: Did he act alone or was he himself framed in the same way as Mark Walhlberg's character in Shooter? (Members of the Tokyo CIA station told the San Francisco Chronicle in 1978 that it was common knowledge there that Lee Harvey Oswald was one of them.) :shock:

It is hard to tell who really killed Kennedy after so long and seen as he made so many enemies: the CIA, being threatened with disbandment, is a suspect; the Mafia, having been used, betrayed, and affected with deportation, is a suspect; the anti-Castro Cuban exile groups (Bay of Pigs brigade massacre) is a suspect; president Lyndon B Johnson, who succeeded Kennedy and set up the shambolic and suspect Warren Commission to investigate the assassination, is a suspect; the FBI, who was in close contact with Oswald (double agent/espionage/fake communist propaganda/scapegoat?) a couple of weeks prior to the assassination, is suspect; the secret service having been inefficient, is a suspect; Castro and the Soviet Union, are suspects (although would they have risked such an act of war knowing there would be nuclear repercussions? And why kill the American president knowing the US government would survive it?); and then there is the possibility of a coalition of different conspirators - eg. government officials felt compelled to help the assassins cover up an embarrassment: the assassination conspiracy implicated illicit involvement by the US government in plots to assassinate Fidel Castro. :ugeek:

So, whether Lee Harvey Oswald was involved or not, who killed Kennedy? What theory do you agree with (and give your reasons)? Do you have a theory of your own? Vote and elaborate... 8-)

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

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HAGART
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby HAGART » 25 May 2014 03:44

I like Jesse Ventura, love him or hate him. I don't know whodunnit, but it was clearly covered up. The car was refurbished without a forensic investigation. (This is before my time, but that's what I hear. I can't speculate further).

I can talk about a big event in my life time having to do with the World Trade Center, but that's a another topic. Similar, but not directly relevant, so I'll let my conspiracy theories slide.

So who dunnit? I don't know. But I've noticed that it's human nature to love these big mysteries and, to this day, people still don't know who Jack The Ripper was, but we all love a good story.

To sum it up. I don't care about the answers, that's all theory and I get labeled a conspiracy theorist, but I can smell bull-shit and it travels far even if I can't tell where exactly it's coming from. ;)

There's a lot of BS in the JFK Ass.
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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Summerlander
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby Summerlander » 26 May 2014 14:48

Well, at least Mr. Ventura is somewhat pertinent to this discussion as he served in the Vietnam war, entered the world of politics, and even authored a book called "They Killed Our President - 63 reasons To Believe There Was a Conspiracy To Assassinate JFK." (I've already added this marvellous book to my to-read list and wonder if he's mentioned JFK in his "Off The Grid" - perhaps you can enlighten me on this?) I also admire someone who publicly backs gay rights. Fair play to him!

It appears that Ventura's suspicions about the US Government having conspired to murder Kennedy agree with mine - and his reasons are not confined to Fidel Castro telling him so. (Of course the Cuban leader would say this and Ventura is intelligent enough to know that.) And it is not the first time the US Government comes up with pretexts as a means to an end. We can talk about 9/11 here if you want. It is very possible, if not highly probable, that the Bush administration allowed Osama Bin Laden's cohort to wound their nation in order to make war with the Middle East. (Just like Roosevelt knew about Pearl Harbour and welcomed it!)

But this is as far as the conspiracy goes. Forget the French best seller that tells you the Pentagon was struck by a missile on Bush's orders! I am currently reading Christopher Hitchens' memoir, and, in the book, he mentions that his friend Barbara Olsen was aboard the plane that crashed into the great behemoth. She had called her husband to inform him that she had been hijacked. He, in turn, informed her that she and the passengers weren't hostages - they would all be murdered as part of a hideous plan (jihad).

Btw, I noticed that you selected the "Shadow Government" option. Would you like to elaborate? Do you believe something like the Illuminati is behind all these events and cover-ups? Sorry to push you, but, I'm just trying to enrich this topic. :mrgreen:
Last edited by Summerlander on 27 May 2014 13:41, edited 2 times in total.
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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HAGART
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby HAGART » 27 May 2014 04:08

I was surprised when you replied, saying you actually knew who Jesse Ventura is, and agree with him. He does have a military and political background so you can't discredit him. I'm inclined to believe him. I was actually expecting you to denounce him.

Love him or hate him, he certainly isn't afraid to speak his mind!

I never read his books, but I'm a You Tube Junkie. ;) :D

But you asked me a good question. Who is behind it all? I actually don't know. I think it may be more of a 'WHAT' than a 'WHO'. And that one thing is.... drum roll please......delaying for suspense...... MONEY!

All questions can be answered by following the money. 8-)


As for my official vote: I was the one person (so far) who chose 'other please specify'. I like to look at the root of the problem that makes it be and not see the tip of the plant. The flower is pretty and the root is dirty, but you have to start at the root!
If we all lucid dreamed this world would be a better place.

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btifuldreamer
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby btifuldreamer » 27 May 2014 10:11

I was researching into this a while ago and thought it was the government or illuminati but now not so much. One thought i had was maybe someone asked Oswald to kill JFK then after he was killed so no info can be given. I probably just got that idea from almost every movie about assasinations and spies ;) If it was really Lee Harvey it's unfortunate he was killed because he could have given vital information. I also read somewhere JFK was killed because he was the only president doing his job right. They're releasing the autopsy report or files in 2016 aren't they? That will bring up more questions than answers :|
I've watched some videos on Jesse Ventura before. One about how the American Government are preparing concentration camps or something? Also how they found 1000's of empty coffins. Interesting stuff :geek:

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Summerlander
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby Summerlander » 27 May 2014 13:20

btifuldreamer wrote:I was researching into this a while ago and thought it was the government or illuminati but now not so much. One thought i had was maybe someone asked Oswald to kill JFK then after he was killed so no info can be given. I probably just got that idea from almost every movie about assasinations and spies ;) If it was really Lee Harvey it's unfortunate he was killed because he could have given vital information. I also read somewhere JFK was killed because he was the only president doing his job right. They're releasing the autopsy report or files in 2016 aren't they? That will bring up more questions than answers :|
I've watched some videos on Jesse Ventura before. One about how the American Government are preparing concentration camps or something? Also how they found 1000's of empty coffins. Interesting stuff :geek:


Lee Harvey Oswald's body was exhumed, on account of an enquiry, and dental records proved that it was really him who was killed and buried. I think in a couple of years they will be forced to divulge more information about the assassination of JFK as part of a '90s Act which I forget the name of. From what I can gather, the grassy knoll shooter was poppycock and part of the disinformation program led by Lyndon B Johnson.

As for Kennedy doing the right thing, far from it. He made many enemies in the course of his presidency and did not handle the problem he had inherited from Eisenhower so well. He also made Cold War enemies in the African continent by refusing to help them in freeing themselves from colonial imperialists in Europe. Because of this, they would then turn to socialist regimes - who were already anti-American - for aid.

Most of the time, Kennedy had to pop pills as his medical condition meant he was in constant pain most of the time. His philandering was immature and compromised national security. The FBI even had to keep an eye on a former Nazi and suspected spy that he was seeing! J Edgar Hoover knew all about Kennedy's dirty secrets...

And let's not forget JFK's cowardice during the Bay of Pigs (where the Mafia had been used), and the fact that he nearly killed us all when the missile crisis ensued. The mobsters also had motive to kill him seen as they were displeased with Robert Kennedy and wanted to prevent further assailability on his part.

If you don't know about the Bay of Pigs, by the way, read this and see why Kennedy should have grown a pair of balls, backed the Cuban exiles all the way, and been more forthcoming with the American public:
http://www.forum.obe4u.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=15266

HAGART wrote:But you asked me a good question. Who is behind it all? I actually don't know. I think it may be more of a 'WHAT' than a 'WHO'. And that one thing is.... drum roll please......delaying for suspense...... MONEY!

All questions can be answered by following the money. 8-)


Bottom line, yes, can't beat it. Unless we lose faith in the whole system. And power is also an important factor in the hideous equation. :twisted:

Poll update: so far, 50% says a coalition of some or all of the mentioned potential conspirators; 25% for a shadow government (secret society); and 25% other (which remains unspecified - unless I've missed the point). 8-)
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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SGMGI
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby SGMGI » 12 Jul 2014 19:52

I was watching a very interesting documentary for research of a school project. It was claiming that Lee Harvey Oswald can't have been acting alone, for a number of reasons.

1. The rifle he was using was not powerful or accurate enough, and it was an old rifle that was likely to jam. He supposedly fired 3 shots in 9 seconds with a Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action rifle, two of which hit the President.
2. When he was in the marines he was not a very good shot, and so how could he have hit a moving target from that far away? 3 expert marksmen tried to recreate the situation, and missed 20 out of 21 one times.
3. He did not fire enough rounds. Unless you believe in the "Magic bullet theory" then he simply did not fire enough rounds and it did not correlate with the amount fired.
4. Reports of gunshots coming from the "grassy knoll" indicate that there was more than one gunman.

I think that It was the Communists, as Lee had lived in Russia for a period of time before the assasination, but i think that he was most definatly not acting alone.
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Summerlander
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby Summerlander » 13 Jul 2014 00:35

If you think the Communists did it make sure you cast your vote. It's true that Lee Harvey Oswald was a Communist...or at least he gave that impression. What if it was disinformation or false propaganda on his part while he worked on a top secret mission? What do you think about reports feom Tokyo that he was a member of the CIA?

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

Snaggle
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby Snaggle » 13 Jul 2014 16:19

SGMGI wrote:I was watching a very interesting documentary for research of a school project. It was claiming that Lee Harvey Oswald can't have been acting alone, for a number of reasons.

1. The rifle he was using was not powerful or accurate enough, and it was an old rifle that was likely to jam. He supposedly fired 3 shots in 9 seconds with a Mannlicher-Carcano bolt-action rifle, two of which hit the President.
2. When he was in the marines he was not a very good shot, and so how could he have hit a moving target from that far away? 3 expert marksmen tried to recreate the situation, and missed 20 out of 21 one times.
3. He did not fire enough rounds. Unless you believe in the "Magic bullet theory" then he simply did not fire enough rounds and it did not correlate with the amount fired.
4. Reports of gunshots coming from the "grassy knoll" indicate that there was more than one gunman.

I think that It was the Communists, as Lee had lived in Russia for a period of time before the assasination, but i think that he was most definatly not acting alone.


1.-2. Bolt action rifles don't jam. It's semi-automatic and automatic firearms that jam. Jamming happens when a spent round is being ejected and instead becomes trapped in the "bolt" one pulls back to initially chamber the first round - these weapons then will not fire until it's removed. With a bolt action weapon one pushes the bolt up, pulls it back, then pushes it forward and down. The rifle itself was a standard issue Italian military weapon and the Italians have never been good gun makers, even so it was plenty powerful and accurate enough to have done the job.

Oswald had 6-7.5 seconds to fire three rounds. I've fired 3 aimed shots in well under 6 seconds with bolt action firearms none of which missed. Oswald's target was only 85 yards, but he was indeed a crappy shot and had a scope (it takes a lot longer to aim with a scope and one has to aim again after every shot using a bolt action) that was not adjusted with a barrel - in otherwords totally inaccurate. Someone as bad a shot as Oswald could not have done it in my opinion. Oswald's shooting by someone who witnessed his ability http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nS9Zi0B60lw

3. There were five rounds fired. We know this because one motorcycle cops had his microphone stuck on and the shots were recorded - this evidence proves Oswald's innocence or at least that he did not act alone.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKIeMZSJCEA

5. The Soviets had no reason to assassinate JFK. They were quite happy with him. Despite Summerland's horrible history, JFK actually saved the world from a nuclear war during the Cuban missile crises. He was trying to defuse the Cold War. Our country had a massive edge over the USSR during the 1960's and the Joint Chiefs of staff and the other demons at the Rand corporation wanted desperately to use them and take out the Soviets. JKF cut a deal with Kruchev in which the Soviets would pull their nukes out of Cuba and he would pull ours out that immediately threatened the USSR. He was also starting to pull both the CIA and American military advisers out of Vietnam. He asked his old commander General Douglas Macarthur for advice on Vietnam and was told it was a deatn trap for American forces.
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deschainXIX
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Re: JFK Assassination

Postby deschainXIX » 13 Jul 2014 17:56

I think the reason people question this so much and pull out all these crazy conspiracy theories is because they don't want to accept the revelation that one mentally-unbalanced, lonely, angry man can kill the most powerful person on the planet and bring a nation to its knees if he's simply at the right moment at the right time. A world in which this could happen is not only absurd ... but totally insane.

(My vote is that Oswald acted alone. Never been much for conspiracies, but I'd put it at a 97% chance that he acted alone based on research.)
Well said.


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