Lucid Dreamers and God

For those who wish to discuss the purely scientific aspects of sleep and dreams, including new research and future technologies.

Have you ever tried to communicate with God in the phase state (LD/OOBE/AP)?

Yes, and I was successful
3
7%
Yes, but nothing happened
2
4%
Yes, but what was encountered was a product of my mind
5
11%
No, but I am willing to try
21
47%
No, and I'm reluctant to try out of fear
0
No votes
No, and I never will (I'm an atheist who doesn't see any point)
14
31%
 
Total votes: 45

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Summerlander
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Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Summerlander » 17 Oct 2014 10:56

Do post what you find! :-)

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"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

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Derpybunneh
Posts: 89
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 22:27

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Derpybunneh » 28 Nov 2014 15:51

Summerlander wrote: there is no evidence for such Being.


No evidence? Wrong. The whole world is evidence that God exists. Your existence proves that God is real. Everything you see, taste, touch, and feel proves that God exists. The planets moving in their orbit; how could a random explosion create the planets in such a perfect order and place? Only God could do this. Nothing else can and nothing else did.
LUCID DREAMS: 5
DREAMS: 9000+

“I believe that one day the Darwinian myth will be ranked the greatest
deceit in the history of science.” Søren Løvtrup

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Summerlander
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Joined: 22 Sep 2011 19:52

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Summerlander » 28 Nov 2014 17:57

Firstly, everything in this universe works without the presumption of such a being. Secondly, things never used to be like this. Evolution, carried by the blind forces of nature, resulted in what we see today. And things are still changing. Thirdly, perfect order and place? Really? Because Earth is so hospitable with its natural catastrophes, right? (Sarcasm intended.) Check the OP and see where I've already pointed out how the universe is mostly a waste and how scientists can already conceive of a better world once they contemplate all of nature's haphazard mistakes.

If you say God is the universe, you must mean it in the symbolic sense. Because the almighty literal sense where He judges us is yet to be demonstrated. (And a god of this nature would be vile and not worth worshipping.) Whichever way you mean it, IT is very imperfect.:-D

I don't see any evidence for God whatsoever therefore I do not believe. If He is and He made me, then He is pretty dumb. Why create atheists? lol

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Last edited by Summerlander on 28 Nov 2014 18:01, edited 1 time in total.
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

User avatar
Derpybunneh
Posts: 89
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 22:27

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Derpybunneh » 28 Nov 2014 18:00

Summerlander wrote:Firstly, everything in this universe works with the presumption of such a being. Secondly, things never used to be like this. Evolution, carried by the blind forces of nature, resulted in what we see today. And things are still changing. Thirdly, perfect order and place? Really? Because Earth is so hospitable with its natural catastrophes, right? (Sarcasm intended.) Check the OP and see where I've already pointed out how the universe is mostly a waste and how scientists can already conceive of a better world once they contemplate all of nature's haphazard mistakes.

If you say God is the universe, you must mean it in the symbolic sense. Because the almighty literal sense where He judges us is yet to be drmonstrated. (And a god of this nature would be vile and not worth worshipping.) Whichever way you mean it, IT is very imperfect.:-D

I don't see any evidence for God whatsoever there I do not believe. If He is and He made me, then He is pretty dumb. Why create atheists? lol

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Why would it be dumb if he created you? He created humans after his own image, and they did not come from monkeys. It would be dumb if we were evolved from monkeys.
LUCID DREAMS: 5
DREAMS: 9000+

“I believe that one day the Darwinian myth will be ranked the greatest
deceit in the history of science.” Søren Løvtrup

User avatar
Summerlander
Posts: 3656
Joined: 22 Sep 2011 19:52

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Summerlander » 28 Nov 2014 18:10

It would be dumb of a creator to create beings who do not believe in him. Also, does he create psychopaths in his image? lol. Well, he must do if he wipes out men women and children with tsunamis...:-D

We did not come from monkeys. You are right. But humans and monkeys do share a distant common ancestor that was ape-like. Darwin's theory is an established fact as supported by untold scientific evidence. His cousin also gave the religious the benefit of the doubt by testing the effectiveness of praying and found it to be ineffective.

You say you know that we were created in God's imagine. Tell me, have you ever seen Him? Is He shaped like the universe or like a human being? Why not a cockroach? What have you got to bring to the table other than what many people are told in their childhood which so lame and cliched: "We are made in the lord image." "Santa is watching you." "The tooth fairy will come while you sleep."

Oh dear...

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

User avatar
Derpybunneh
Posts: 89
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 22:27

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Derpybunneh » 28 Nov 2014 18:22

Summerlander wrote:It would be dumb of a creator to create beings who do not believe in him. Also, does he create psychopaths in his image? lol. Well, he must do if he wipes out men women and children with tsunamis...:-D

We did not come from monkeys. You are right. But humans and monkeys do share a distant common ancestor that was ape-like. Darwin's theory is an established fact as supported by untold scientific evidence. His cousin also gave the religious the benefit of the doubt by testing the effectiveness of praying and found it to be ineffective.

You say you know that we were created in God's imagine. Tell me, have you ever seen Him? Is He shaped like the universe or like a human being? Why not a cockroach? What have you got to bring to the table other than what many people are told in their childhood which so lame and cliched: "We are made in the lord image." "Santa is watching you." "The tooth fairy will come while you sleep."

Oh dear...

[ Post made via Android ] Image


God created all humans, whether they believe in him or not. They get to choose if they want to believe in their creator. It is not dumb that he did this. He was sending us to earth so we could gain a physical body and become like him, if we choose. With my physical eyes, I have never seen God. But you, me, and everyone has seen God before we were born. We just don't have any memory of it. God cares about all of his children. God allows bad things to happen to us and others. If he did not allow this, we could not become like him. It's all apart of living life. Bad things happen.
LUCID DREAMS: 5
DREAMS: 9000+

“I believe that one day the Darwinian myth will be ranked the greatest
deceit in the history of science.” Søren Løvtrup

User avatar
Summerlander
Posts: 3656
Joined: 22 Sep 2011 19:52

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Summerlander » 28 Nov 2014 18:31

He allows bad things to happen to people? Gulp! He's so good, isn't He! :-D

God made us. Gives us a choice to suffer. Sure. There is so much evidence for that. :-)

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

User avatar
Derpybunneh
Posts: 89
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 22:27

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Derpybunneh » 28 Nov 2014 19:24

Summerlander wrote:He allows bad things to happen to people? Gulp! He's so good, isn't He! :-D

God made us. Gives us a choice to suffer. Sure. There is so much evidence for that. :-)

[ Post made via Android ] Image


Look, it is not God's fault that we suffer. It happens just because that's the way the world is. Bad stuff happens also because of other's choices, and sometimes God does send bad stuff because he is trying to teach us or trying to wipe out extremely bad people (not saying that the people who get killed by tsunamis are bad). e need to have opposition, otherwise it would be pointless even to exist. It's his way of testing us to see if we will be faithful to him or not. John 16:33, "These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world."

I know these things because I belong to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormons).
LUCID DREAMS: 5
DREAMS: 9000+

“I believe that one day the Darwinian myth will be ranked the greatest
deceit in the history of science.” Søren Løvtrup

User avatar
Summerlander
Posts: 3656
Joined: 22 Sep 2011 19:52

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Summerlander » 28 Nov 2014 23:49

According to your unwarranted belief, the world is the way it is because GOD MADE IT SO. Therefore He is responsible for all the evil in the world. Thus, we logically conclude that He can't possibly be a perfectly good god.

They say He is the creator of everything: omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent. Therefore one cannot say He gave us free will or that bad things happen independently of God. He authored everything if He is all-powerful and omnipresent. Thus, if you really believe in God, you must also believe that tsunami victims deserved to suffer and die because God thought it best. Tens of thousands in one swoop, men, women and children...babies included...

So you're a Mormon? Is that the best you got? The word of one conman Joseph Smith, a fraudster, a lunatic and compulsive liar with a penchant for underage girls and several wives...

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Empty cognizance of one taste, suffused with knowing, is your unmistaken nature, the uncontrived original state. when not altering what is, allow it to be as it is, and the awakened state is right now spontaneously present."

- Padmasambhava

User avatar
Derpybunneh
Posts: 89
Joined: 16 Sep 2014 22:27

Re: Lucid Dreamers and God

Postby Derpybunneh » 29 Nov 2014 02:32

Summerlander wrote:According to your unwarranted belief, the world is the way it is because GOD MADE IT SO. Therefore He is responsible for all the evil in the world. Thus, we logically conclude that He can't possibly be a perfectly good god.

They say He is the creator of everything: omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent. Therefore one cannot say He gave us free will or that bad things happen independently of God. He authored everything if He is all-powerful and omnipresent. Thus, if you really believe in God, you must also believe that tsunami victims deserved to suffer and die because God thought it best. Tens of thousands in one swoop, men, women and children...babies included...

So you're a Mormon? Is that the best you got? The word of one conman Joseph Smith, a fraudster, a lunatic and compulsive liar with a penchant for underage girls and several wives...

[ Post made via Android ] Image


Tsunamis are caused by weather. Only rarely God would send a tsunami. God is the perfectly good God. He is the most just person in the world. More just than the supposed "just" people here. He gives everyone a fair chance to choose if they will follow him or not. He IS the one who gave us free will to choose evil or good. Joseph Smith is NOT a fraudster, lunatic, and liar. He translated the Gold Plates into the Book of Mormon. There is evidence that he did not make that book up.

Read this, 1 Nephi 8:2, "And it came to pass that while my father tarried in the wilderness he spake unto us, saying: Behold, I have dreamed a dream; or, in other words, I have seen a vision."

Dreamed a dream. That part is redundant. The English in Joseph Smith's time would not be like that. It would be more like this, "I had a dream." The scripture above is proof that JS (Joseph Smith) did not make the book up.

Even if he was a polygamist, it does not really change my view on him. The culture was different back then.

Boy, I love arguing about religion. :lol:
LUCID DREAMS: 5
DREAMS: 9000+

“I believe that one day the Darwinian myth will be ranked the greatest
deceit in the history of science.” Søren Løvtrup


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