What are your religious views?

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What are your religious views?

Deeply religious - I follow a strict religious code and trust my life to a higher authority
22
19%
Somewhat religious - I believe in a higher intelligence watching over us
38
32%
Agnostic - I'm on the fence; you really can't say either way at this time
29
25%
Atheist - I don't believe there is a higher intelligence watching over us
29
25%
 
Total votes: 118

Ty8200
Posts: 105
Joined: 04 Jun 2012 08:26

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ty8200 » 28 Jun 2012 05:01

Summerlander wrote:Quantum mechanically speaking, it is often said that the universe secretly plays out all scenarios before concluding the most probable one. This is one perspective. On time travel, one can be sure of this: we can 'skip' time by travelling at speeds near that of light. Or at least time will affect you less the faster you go. In this sense, it seems more apparent that only travelling to the future is possible but you can never go back (well, so far it seems that way).

It's funny how in the film Time Cop it is the other way around. Travelling to the future is impossible but you can always go back. But don't the time travellers get back to their present time which is the future of the past time they visit (which really becomes their 'continuum present' the moment they enter it)? In a sense, everything has already happened. To spice it up, they throw the parallel universes equation into the mix (and this is a real possibility!).

Perhaps everything has already happened but at the same time, it hasn't always happened in the same way. In this universe you may be an atheist, but, in another, you might have completely let your guard down and allowed yourself to be influenced by a God-fearing cult! :mrgreen:

In another, you might have never heard of Stephen LaBerge or Rebecca Turner and never discovered or even got to experience lucid dreams... :cry:


I say we're really just tiny hippos and the ground we stand on is really just a giant hippo. And the universe is millions of big and small hippos all floating around. Makes sense to me :ugeek:
Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth.
Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.
Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock.
Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.

SGraham
Posts: 119
Joined: 13 Jun 2012 00:59
Location: California

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby SGraham » 28 Jun 2012 05:39

Ty8200 wrote:I said "higher power", not God. When Gram was describing what he thought I meant, he described God.

Ok if you honestly weren't talking about god then sorry , but its just a little hard to believe considering all your posts in this topic so far have aimed at trying to discredit Summerlander and I by defending the existance of god. so when you say Higher power i dont emediatly think " oh by higher power he just means a life form greater than humans" i mean common when a religious person says higher power they are usualy refering to god.
By the way its Graham not Gram
How do you define real ?
think it over it's a tough question...

Ty8200
Posts: 105
Joined: 04 Jun 2012 08:26

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ty8200 » 28 Jun 2012 05:44

SGraham wrote:
Ty8200 wrote:I said "higher power", not God. When Gram was describing what he thought I meant, he described God.

Ok if you honestly weren't talking about god then sorry , but its just a little hard to believe considering all your posts in this topic so far have aimed at trying to discredit Summerlander and I by defending the existance of god. so when you say Higher power i dont emediatly think " oh by higher power he just means a life form greater than humans" i mean common when a religious person says higher power they are usualy refering to god.
By the way its Graham not Gram


What are you talking about? I don't even believe in God! Have you even read our posts. I haven't been trying to discredit SL, I respect him. As far as I know, we've been having a nice debate. Have I missed something?

EDIT: I know it's Graham, just teasing you.
Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth.
Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.
Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock.
Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.

SGraham
Posts: 119
Joined: 13 Jun 2012 00:59
Location: California

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby SGraham » 28 Jun 2012 05:51

wait what :o you dont believe in god ?!? ok well sorry just your posts led me to believe that you believed in god
How do you define real ?
think it over it's a tough question...

Ty8200
Posts: 105
Joined: 04 Jun 2012 08:26

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ty8200 » 28 Jun 2012 05:51

Summerlander wrote:In the dark space between galaxies, scientists discovered a kind of relic radiation which supports the idea of a large explosion responsible for the observable universe (whether some like it or not, this supports the Big Bang theory - there really was an unimaginably massive explosion!!).

This radiation is uniform in all directions. Roughly the same levels of energy are observed between two areas even if they are a gazillion light-years or even parsecs apart. Some might think of this as an amazing coincidence but I say it is only a natural occurrence in the universal "well".

I'm going to go on a red tangent here to address some of the issues raised by Ty8200 before arriving at the alien debate...

I like describing our universe like a well. A well where cause and effect reigns no matter how magical what happens in it seems. Like quantum entanglement or "spooky action at a distance" which seems to violate the light speed limit rule.

But the Pauli Exclusion Principle (sorry for the physics jargon again but look it up if you have to) is the reason why we don't fall through the floor and states that in the universal well, two electrons of seemingly the same energies are not exactly the same and cannot occupy the same quantum state. One might say that an individual electron "knows" the state of every other electron in the universe and thus adopts the most probable state. But the electron is not a conscious entity and there is no magic at play here. I could go on with the jargon and quote formulae that looks alien to everyone but there is a simpler way to look at this via analogy: imagine that the universe is a bowl of marbles and these marbles are making contact inside... now, imagine that you remove one of the marbles... you can see that, with such removal, the pressure from the other ones would push or force another to fill the gap that was left behind - and lo and behold, the whole system is affected!!.

This is how electrons "know" what one another is doing even if they are light-years apart. It's the interconnection of particles that force them to adopt integer and half-integer spins in a pool of waves where peaks and troughs add or cancel each other out in the probabilistic framework...


Yes, I love science... :geek: ... sorry... but I can also be cool! 8-)

It is not hard, then, (and I'm getting to the alien thing!) to envisage that, as atomic structures became more complex in the development of the universe, similar lifeforms would emerge and evolve in similar ways. Life is quite diverse here on Earth anyway. There are many Earth-like planets out there, and, what's more, they are even considering looking into "inhospitable" planets as there is a chance that extremophiles might have had a chance to evolve into complex lifeforms overtime.

In saying all of the above, and considering the vastness of what we can observe in the universe, the odds favour the notion that we are not alone. Science acknowledges this and hence why we have programs like SETI. If one day we come across intelligent lifeforms out there, our best bet is to use the language of mathematics to communicate with them. The film Contact starring Jodie Foster is quite educational. The issues surrounding religious fanaticism, the belief in a higher power or God, who should represent the human race (a theist or an atheist?) and how the world would react at the discovery of an alien civilisation are clearly addressed there.

More chances of finding alien than God.

On the "higher power"... it depends what you mean by it - in which case we may be talking semantics here. The higher power term can be used for something conscious that exists but may not necessarily have created anything and may not even be transcendental - even if the aliens give us a transcendental impression!!

Usually, things are not what they seem and it is very easy to see magic in that which you don't yet understand. Imagine showing a mobile phone or a computer to someone in 50 AD!! This goes back to what I was saying about children and how impressionable they are.


Oops, I left the forum for a few days and I've been thrown to the sidelines :cry:

Anyway, yes. I get what you are saying about the electrons.

I have a very weird feeling in my head (no, it's not the feeling of my first thought, Summerlander). It's sort of an... indescribable feeling. I have it when pondering the true reasons we exist. Not just us, everything. The whole picture. How everything is. And the feeling arises when I let go. When I realize that there's nothing I can do to know. It's a freeing feeling. I almost feel certain detachment. A release from something... It's hard to describe. It's a part of my "believe in everything, believe in nothing" state of mind. It's the simplest and most complex state. But I would have it no other way. For me, it's the truest thing to believe. Maybe I was born different, since I seem so different. It seems everyone needs answers. But we can only do so much as humans. Who's to say we're right. Even the brightest minds can make an error we go on for the end of humanity. For all we know, we could be dreaming. Think of it. If you never awoke from a dream, you would consider it your reality. Perhaps this life is a dream, and when we die, we awake only to have another. Perhaps who I'm typing to this very moment doesn't even exist. It's all truly possible. Perhaps not in this dream, but when we awake.

Very interesting to me. Maybe we are just piles of bones and organs that exist for the sake of random occurrence. Maybe not. Maybe the entire universe we know is a figment of our imagination. Maybe not. I choose to believe in this way because it's the one thing I can be sure of. Science is also very interesting to me, but it doesn't fall outside my belief. I feel harmony, in one word. That is the feeling.
Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth.
Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.
Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock.
Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.

Ty8200
Posts: 105
Joined: 04 Jun 2012 08:26

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Ty8200 » 28 Jun 2012 05:54

SGraham wrote:wait what :o you dont believe in god ?!? ok well sorry just your posts led me to believe that you believed in god


I am agnostic which means I believe in the possibility of God, but do not think he is there for sure. Where as Atheists "know" there is no God. And where strongly religious people "know" there is a God.
Reality is the sight, where reflection is the truth.
Water is the glass, where deception is the stone.
Reality is the cage, where limit is the lock.
Mind is the key, where only the blind can see.

SGraham
Posts: 119
Joined: 13 Jun 2012 00:59
Location: California

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby SGraham » 28 Jun 2012 15:49

oh well sorry it's just that you defended the possibility of the exsistance of god so pasionatly that i just assumed you were religious. and you know what hapens when you assume . . .
any way i know the definition of agnostic you dont need to define it . but id consider my self an agnostic atheist because im almost certian of the non existance of God but yeah its not like i can prove it. but agnostic athiest sounds stupid so if i had to go by one or the other id go by athiest.
How do you define real ?
think it over it's a tough question...

User avatar
Worldenterer1
Posts: 347
Joined: 03 Sep 2011 19:35
Location: Earth

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Worldenterer1 » 28 Jun 2012 18:42

SGraham wrote:Well i my self am an Atheist and i was not raised one so all religious views i have i developed my self. any way i do believe in the exsistance of extra terrestrial life forms and no im not a UFO nut. i think that the universe is so large that the non exsistance of aliens is mathematicly impossible. as i said im not a UFO nut and i also dont think they have visited Earth i just think they are out there somewhere. so baisicly to boil down my post i think believing in the exsistance of aliens is much more logical than a transendant being that created the Universe.


Agree completely
Lucid Dream Count: 10
Normal Dream Count: 100+
Goal for next LD: Think with portals.

User avatar
Worldenterer1
Posts: 347
Joined: 03 Sep 2011 19:35
Location: Earth

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby Worldenterer1 » 28 Jun 2012 18:53

Ty8200 wrote:Very interesting to me. Maybe we are just piles of bones and organs that exist for the sake of random occurrence. Maybe not. Maybe the entire universe we know is a figment of our imagination. Maybe not. I choose to believe in this way because it's the one thing I can be sure of. Science is also very interesting to me, but it doesn't fall outside my belief. I feel harmony, in one word. That is the feeling.


http://youtu.be/9D05ej8u-gU?hd=1
Lucid Dream Count: 10
Normal Dream Count: 100+
Goal for next LD: Think with portals.

SGraham
Posts: 119
Joined: 13 Jun 2012 00:59
Location: California

Re: What are your religious views?

Postby SGraham » 28 Jun 2012 20:10

pretty awseome video, neil degrass tyson is the best. any way i watched the first video you suggested way back when this topic was first created. (the one with the milk jug) and yeah it sumed things up pretty well.
How do you define real ?
think it over it's a tough question...


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