Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Discuss external aids which help you lucid dream including brainwave entrainment, supplements and herbs, lucid dream masks, and more.
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Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby ssells » 20 May 2011 06:44

Has anyone tried any of the available Mind Machines such as Nova Pro 100 or Procyon? If so did you find them effective? Did they meet your need? I have a friend who tonight was telling me he uses Procyon and found their entrainment programs beneficial.

Mine machines are usually the size of mp3 players and they have input jacks for both headphones and special glasses. Their entrainment programs use both visual and audio. They are fairly expensive as you have to buy a dedicated device because of the glasses.

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Re: Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby PaulG » 22 May 2011 22:21

I have been using them for the last 10 years and currently have 3 machines (Mindlab Proteus, DAVID PAL 36 with CES and The Laxman). Although they have never induced lucid dreams for me (this is something I'm currently working on) I consider them excellent for inducing meditative states (they do increase my dream recall). The main reason for this is that research has shown that flashing light is 2 - 3 times more effective for inducing brainwaves sates than sound and when using a mind machine 75 - 80 % of the effect comes from the flashing light.

Most machines work on the same principle. Flashing light via the eyes and pulsing tones through the ears. Some of the DAVID models made by Mind Alive in Canada also have cranial electrotherapy stimulation (CES) via ear clips or snap-on electrodes attached to the Mastoid Process (the bony lump behind the ear).

Maybe ideal for people who are looking at some form of brainwave entrainment for inducing lucid dreams and I certainly agree, based on my own usage, that they are a lot more effective at inducing meditative states, as opposed to just using sound (brainwave entrainment CDs, Mp3s etc.)

All machines do come with a disclaimer however, that everyone should be aware of and may read something like this

"Mind machines are not intended to diagnosis or treat any physical or mental / emotional disease or condition. Individuals with epilepsy (seizure disorders), cardiac arrhythmia, brain tumors, brain cancer, traumatic brain injury (closed head injury), or using powerful psychotropic medication, illegal drugs or who drink alcohol should NOT use a mind machine. To do so may be dangerous to you. Photosensitive epilepsy is a relatively rare condition that can be evoked by flashing lights including those in a light/sound session. Persons with a known history of epilepsy or have the potential for a seizure should NOT use light/sound systems. Some photosensitive persons may never had had a seizure and are unaware of their condition".

I agree they are quite expensive (the DAVID & Laxman models a lot more so) and mine are slightly bigger than the average Mp3 player but tend to be about 2 - 3 times larger in depth, but still very much portable. I do however consider those made by MindPlace (such as the Procyon you mentioned) to be reasonably priced.

Naturally, when buying a machine from new, it will come with everything you need, but there are a lot of accessories for these machines (such as different colored glasses, third-party software etc.) that can add to the cost. The main selling point of these machines is that they claim you can reach deep meditative states in only a few months, what would normally take years of practice, by just meditating alone, with no external aids. Based on my own usage over the years, I would agree with that.

Whilst most machines may look similar, and seem to operate on the same principle, all machines have subtle differences and have features unique to the machine, which may or may not be a factor for some people, should they be thinking about buying one.

One excellent resource I often visit is a blog by someone named Craig Tice (who goes by the nick CraigT on some forums) and also lives in New Zealand, I believe. He has done quite a few independent reviews of mind machines and does write a lot of articles on brainwave entrainment, which can be found here


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Re: Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby 1Mike » 27 May 2011 01:03

There is a 'WILD inducer' in Liquid Dreams that flashes the screen. I have had some trippy visuals with it, but was hoping for more. :?

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Re: Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby Jonathan » 01 Jun 2011 04:07

I don't yet have any experience with these things. Hey Paul -- thanks for the detailed response. Interesting.

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Re: Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby ssells » 02 Jun 2011 05:06

Thanks for the response Paul. It was quite helpful.

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Re: Mind Machines - Anyone try them?

Postby dalbright214 » 21 Jun 2013 10:25

I have tried a few different mind machines myself, such as the Procyon you mentioned, the Proteus, the Laxman, the Orion, and the Photosonix.... The MindPlace machines always ended up being very disappointing to me. I invested a lot of money into their products and always seemed to have some sort of problem with them. Not meaning to bash the company, but I definitely would not recommend them to someone personally. Before the Laxman, I had always enjoyed the Orion the most and was quite sad when they stopped being manufactured. I bought the Laxman about 7 months ago and am absolutely blown away! It definitely took a little chunk out of my wallet but I am more than pleased. I have never been able to reach such a deep state of relaxation and dreaming.

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