SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

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Allyk47
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Joined: 09 Mar 2015 20:37

SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Allyk47 » 19 Mar 2015 17:29

Most nights, I can get pretty close to a successful WILD if I go to bed tired enough.
I'd say at least once every other night I feel like I'm getting a reasonable shot at it.
I'll start hearing things, or getting tipping sensations.... So on, so forth. All the basic LD precursors.

But so MUCH lately, I've been getting anxiety therein, and I don't understand why. I should be so excited to be getting the opportunity to have a good WILD... I don't get it. In a clear, waking mindset, I'm not at all afraid of WILDing....I know everything felt is all "fake", so to speak, and that nothing is going to hurt me, I'm not going to die, so on.

But yet whenever I'm actually in the process of doing it, I always get freaked out. It sucks.
(I guess what the articles say is true; sitting by and watching as your body falls into a temporary death-like state (aka sleep) "can be a terrifying experience")


Everytime I realize I'm half-asleep, or getting into the dream, or hitting SP...I always fight the SP and break out of it rather than using it to move further in. I feel as if the dream and paralysis and so on, are out of my control, and that's NOT the aim of WILDing, clearly. The point of lucid dreaming is dream control. I could 'just let it happen' in any of my infinite amount of non-aware dreams. Not what I'm aiming for here at all.

I guess maybe that's why I get the anxiety?? Because I feel that the ball is not in my court, and a lucid nightmare is just waiting to happen. Last night, for example, as I started to drift off, I kept hearing car horns going off... and I was obviously aware, so I tried to stop them.... No dice. Auditory hallucinations kept on going. And at some point I 'woke up' in sleep paralysis... felt extreme anxiety.... had a false awakening of tossing and turning and throwing myself out of bed&onto the floor to wake up..... And then eventually woke up for real, in bed. I purposefully broke out of the SP and the dream. As I often do.

How do I get a grip on the anxiety, as well as go from just being able to WATCH myself fall asleep [and then WATCHING from there], To being able to control and interact with my dreamscape...?
For a lucid dreamer, realizing you are in SP should be a great thing, used as a bridge, but I always always lose sight of that and break out of it.
:(

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Peter
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Location: New Zealand

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Peter » 19 Mar 2015 17:40

anxious and excited produce the same result, just observe and let it roll or you will chase yourself around and get nowhere by over thinking it all.

Do nothing but let part of your mind go to sleep while another part observes and understand that the "you" is not even important to the process
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

Allyk47
Posts: 19
Joined: 09 Mar 2015 20:37

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Allyk47 » 19 Mar 2015 20:13

It sounds as though your advice is basically, 'just go to sleep' haha

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Peter
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Location: New Zealand

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Peter » 20 Mar 2015 00:12

yes it is exactly that.

One part of your mind goes to sleep and another stays awake and watches and then you are lucid by a WILD

Thats all you are doing but its very hard at first to get the balance right
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born

Snaggle
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Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Snaggle » 20 Mar 2015 00:46

Peter already gave you sound advice, I'll add just forget the body altogether. If you're comfortable enough to sleep you've already done everything you need to do with it.

But yet whenever I'm actually in the process of doing it, I always get freaked out. It sucks.
(I guess what the articles say is true; sitting by and watching as your body falls into a temporary death-like state (aka sleep) "can be a terrifying experience")


Falling into a WILD is nothing like falling into death. Death hurts and hurts a lot. To repeat don't watch your body doing anything. When you enter a WILD you have the opportunity to see things you've never seen about subject you're interested in. Whatever you incubate is usually what you'll see experience. If you were playing Video or PC games you can play them as soon as you go under. If you were incubating art you'll see new and great art. If you were working on a project you'll see new solutions to it.

What you're doing is incubating fear. I understand completely as I've done that too. I was a little kid and did not know what was happening, you're not and have the advantage of LD forums. Just decide what you want and saturate yourself with it in the hour or two before you go to bed.
"There is only one God and his name is Death.
And there is only one thing we say to death "not today"
- Syrio Forel

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taniaaust1
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Location: Adelaide, South Australia

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby taniaaust1 » 20 Mar 2015 01:19

Allyk47 wrote: I guess maybe that's why I get the anxiety?? Because I feel that the ball is not in my court, and a lucid nightmare is just waiting to happen. Last night, for example, as I started to drift off, I kept hearing car horns going off... and I was obviously aware, so I tried to stop them.... No dice. Auditory hallucinations kept on going.


and that should be fine, you shouldn't be trying to stop these, the more you fight a dream situation, the stronger it wants to happen. How do you know its going to be a nightmare? As snaggle said, you are incubating your own fear into this by your own thoughts. With the horns it may just be a case that you are about to find yourself on some LD street with some cars hooting at traffic lights due to a traffic jam and that is the kind of scenario you should be trying to incubate when you are hearing car horns rather then fear situations. If you think something is going to be a nightmare, you are likely to create that situation for yourself.

This is where learning some dream control techniques in your own case needs to start even before you start having your first LD (or you will create a nightmarish LD for yourself). You need to start working on controlling your thoughts and fears in this state. just by intently focusing on more positive things around whatever you are experiencing. You are experiencing the same kind of mind state with your experiences now as you would be when in a LD and if you are freaking now, you will find yourself probably freaking out once you enter the LD and know you are in one.

And at some point I 'woke up' in sleep paralysis... felt extreme anxiety.... had a false awakening of tossing and turning and throwing myself out of bed&onto the floor to wake up..... And then eventually woke up for real, in bed


That isn't sleep paralyses as one doesn't toss and turn in sleep paralyses state. if you are rolling around like that you are actually already in a full dream state. In a sleep paralyses state a person experiences no movement!! No dream movement either.. You were in a proper dream there but cant call this a LD as you weren't aware you were dreaming. You are going into the LD state but not even recognising it as you've been thinking you were in SP, so get rid of the idea of SP as its caused you to miss your first LDs.

How do I get a grip on the anxiety, as well as go from just being able to WATCH myself fall asleep [and then WATCHING from there], To being able to control and interact with my dreamscape...?
For a lucid dreamer, realizing you are in SP should be a great thing, used as a bridge, but I always always lose sight of that and break out of it. [/b] :(


Unfortunately SP isn't a great thing for many and just something they may bring into their "DREAM state" eg instead of finding yourself elsewhere in a dream which can instantly alert a person they have WILDed , you instead can start dreaming in you are stuck in bed in a sleep paralyses state without realising you have already gone into the LD state so miss it as then you don't become lucid of it... what you think can create that very dream. And this is exactly what has happened in your case.

SP is often more of a side pit then a bridge. (It's mostly beginners who are still trying to learn to LD who focus intently on it and cause all the hype that goes on around SP).

Your focus on SP has created the dream scenario of being in your own bed in SP so you have missed probably finding yourself elsewhere in dream. (SP should always be just a side effect of what can happen when trying to LD instead of something expected or a goal to be aiming for as it is a hinderance to many who are trying to LD.. You expect it.. it may happen and people miss then having a LD cause they don't become aware they have gone into a LD state).

I say to all beginners here.. stop trying to have SP as it can hinder you having a WILD (by making it harder for you to become aware when you've started dreaming). You are putting another barrier in the way to overcome to get into a WILD by this focus. Ask yourself are you going to know the difference between dreaming you are laying in bed and really laying in bed not dreaming when both can feel real? So I suggest stop focusing on SP states where you will find yourself laying in bed paralysed and wont know if you've entered a dream or not.
....


You don't keep on watching (putting the experience outside of yourself), recognise when you have entered a dream . In your case you were dreaming you were thrashing around in your body (due to probably a previous focus on expecting SP). Your own bedroom and your bed was your dreamscape on this occasion. You are already experiencing yourself being in a dream (if you don't like your dreams of being in your bed, don't focus on being there). Lots of people don't get any SP.

Anyway, you need to change much of how you are thinking about things so you can experience a good WILD. I hope this helps.
Last edited by taniaaust1 on 20 Mar 2015 02:56, edited 1 time in total.
The only thing to fear is the fear itself

jasmine2
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Joined: 15 Sep 2013 04:42

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby jasmine2 » 20 Mar 2015 02:38

Allyk47, I suggest that before you go to bed you could get in a calm, meditative state and repeat to yourself that, as you encounter any dream-like sensations or visual experiences in the borderland between wakefulness and sleep, or during sleep, these experiences are just a realistic movie arising from the deeper layers of consciousness, and the awareness behind the dreaming is a beneficent, wise guide.

I recommend the following resources, which include some wider discussions of a variety of altered states of awareness.

- Article - "9 Ways To Wake Up From Sleep Paralysis" by Ryan Hurd - dreamstudies.org

- Article - "How To Encourage Sleep Paralysis As A Gateway To Extraordinary Dreaming" by Ryan Hurd - dreamstudies.org

- Book - "Lucid Dreaming: Gateway To The Inner Self" by Robert Waggoner

- Search "Lucid Dream Exchange - Articles" - dreaminglucid.com
(also see in left column - "Interviews" and "Past LDE issues")

- Here at world-of-lucid-dreaming.com
On Home page, click tab "Articles" and scroll down to Categories - An interesting collection of articles, many by Rebecca Turner

- Article - "Overcoming Nightmares - The Lucidity Institute" - lucidity.com
This is Chapt. 10 from the book - "Exploring The World Of Lucid Dreaming" by S. LaBerge and H. Rheingold

- YouTube video - "Robert Monroe's Out Of Body Experiences" - Robert says his experiment with various sound patterns to induce sleep may have helped trigger his initially frightening sensations of vibration, prior to out of body experiences. He decided, "If these vibrations kill me, then let it happen". But he didn't die and became an intrepid explorer of wider states of consciousness.

- Book - "Creative Dreaming" by Patricia Garfield

- YouTube - "Stanislav Grof - Psychology Of The Future: Lessons From Modern Consciousness Research"

Best Wishes - jasmine2

Allyk47
Posts: 19
Joined: 09 Mar 2015 20:37

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Allyk47 » 20 Mar 2015 04:10

I very much appreciate everyone's input, but you guys are just not getting it, Lol.

I -know- how to WILD. I know how to LD. I am very aware of the concept and the procedure.
"You allow yourself to fall asleep while you stay conscious, Your body falls asleep while your mind stays awake".... well Thank you, captain obvious, for taking me back to square one. I am familiar with what a WILD is, thanks.

I'm not "incubating fear" as you guys are insinuating. I incubate nothing but the dreams I intend to have. I never ever expected to BE fearful until it started just HAPPENING. I'm always calm and very excited to get the chance to LD/WILD. The anxiety just comes on somewhere in the process, no matter how calm I begin. For example, with the car horns, Obviously something as random as a car alarm isn't a scary experience to me. It wasn't the sound that scared me, it was my inability to control it or "turn it off". Turn it into something else. Etc. If you can't control anything, there is literally no point in having a lucid dream, That is just frustration waiting to happen.

I asked for advice on how to decrease the unwanted anxiety that seems to happen for no apparent reason. The definition of anxiety (true anxiety, that is. not WORRY but ANXIETY) is "a VAGUE and irrational feeling that something bad will happen".... As well as how to gain better control of my LDs as I enter a WILD, rather than just observing a half-sleep state.... And all you guys are giving me is very generalized and irrelevant tips on lucid dreaming and WILDs; things that I already know. I know how to achieve a body-asleep-mind-awake state. But there is so much more to having a quality LD than having your body be asleep while your mind is up n runnin'. C'mon, you guys know that.

[oh and btw: to the above poster who informed me "sleeping is not like death" so on and so forth, "death is painful".... I didn't say sleeping is IDENTICAL to death, but it does SIMULATE a *death-LIKE state*. I didn't say it was like DYING. Big difference between dying and death. When we sleep (not during dreams, obviously) we are completely unconscious and the world around us ceases to exist; as with death. ]


Thank you everyone, for your tips. I know you guys are trying to help. I guess the hard truth may just be that there really is no "secret" to overcoming the anxiety except for continuing to try to stay calm.

Allyk47
Posts: 19
Joined: 09 Mar 2015 20:37

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Allyk47 » 20 Mar 2015 04:29

Also.... Taniaaust, Your input was probably the most useful.

That isn't sleep paralyses as one doesn't toss and turn in sleep paralyses state. if you are rolling around like that you are actually already in a full dream state. In a sleep paralyses state a person experiences no movement!! No dream movement either.. You were in a proper dream there but cant call this a LD as you weren't aware you were dreaming. You are going into the LD state but not even recognising it as you've been thinking you were in SP, so get rid of the idea of SP as its caused you to miss your first LDs.


First of all, I know what happened. This is why, as you can see, I referred to it as a false awakening. I woke up and wasn't on the floor, lol, so, yeah, I realized it was a dream. But I also believe I truly was in SP, just alternating between dreaming I was trying to break out of it, and actually BEING awake and trying to break out of it, because obviously, at some point, I woke up from it. So I believe it was half & half.

Also, I don't think "condescending" is the proper word here, because I know you didn't know, but I'm not aiming for my "first LD". I've had many, I've been into LD-ing for years, but as most beginners do, Back in the day, I got discouraged and gave up. I recently got back into it a couple months ago and have had plenty of successful LDs. A couple DILDs, WBtBs, and a couple WILDs that did go perfectly fine.

But as of lately, as I've gotten 'better' and had more good opportunities where I'm getting closer to WILDs (as opposed to in the past where I either just fall asleep, or just the opposite- lay up in bed awake, unable to get my body to go to sleep until I say fck it and abandon the attempt to wild), this anxiety crap has been creeping up on me, and I've been finding that at the beginning stages of my wilds, I can't control anything!! I feel that if I just 'submerse myself' and just fall out, I'll miss the chance because I will be sleeping completely, mind and body both out.

Anyway, I appreciate the advice, esp your input about SP. Yes, most of what I have read seems to insinuate that SP should be looked at as a good thing, a bridge. But you are more than likely completely right. I've been thinking that SP -is- expected and a good thing, because, Does SP not signify that you have successfully put your body to sleep while your mind is awake??....BUT, Now that I think about it, after reading your post, I suppose if you are in the dream where you should be, you won't be experiencing SP; you'll be walking around the dreamscape! SP is the WRONG type of 'mind awake/body asleep' and not what we're aiming for here, obviously. So I'll try to get the SP thing out of my head, and hopefully that'll be helpful with SOMEthing, at least. I don't see how that addresses the anxiety or the dream control, but it will definitely prevent another false awakening/sp DREAM due to having sp on the brain, at the very least.

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Peter
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Location: New Zealand

Re: SOMEONE help me get over anxiety during WILD!

Postby Peter » 20 Mar 2015 06:25

I asked for advice on how to decrease the unwanted anxiety that seems to happen for no apparent reason


we are all saying that at one level you expect fear and you get it. I get the same sensations a lot of the time and some wicked visuals and hallucinations as well but now just ignore them and they have no impact.

They cant be scary unless you give them weight. before you WILD next time think of the worst it can be and when you are calm about those images or whatever you are ready to just ignore whatever comes along.
Who are you I asked, the reply "dont be silly, we are your daughers" many years before they were born


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