Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Discuss lucid dreaming techniques including dream recall, MILD, WILD, meditation and other ways of attaining lucidity in dreams.
astrovineyard
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Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby astrovineyard » 13 May 2015 13:18

Recently, while enjoying the end of my last stretch of insomnia, I realized that I had not taken any multivitamins for several years (which I had done my whole life, as a child eating chewables to an adult swallowing pills). I had concluded that since I ate healthy that I shouldn't need them. But my visit to the doctor suggested (without bloodwork) that perhaps a lack of magnesium could cause sleep trouble. And I also read how Vitamin B6 can make dreams more vivid and easier to recall (including giving the occasional nightmare). Though I regularly have a banana with breakfast, I thought I'd try a 100mg B6 before bed.

For several nights I have noticed more interesting dreams than usual, and easier to recall, though still nothing that holds a candle to the epic dreams I used to have.

A couple nights ago I had this dream:

(Some toned-down adult-themed frank material.)

3rd night taking Melatonin and Vitamin B6 together (half hour before bed).

Slept at parent's house. Went to bed around 11:00 p.m. Was hot and took a while to get comfortable. After a few weeks with no insomnia I wondered if it would return. Probably tossed and turned for about an hour. Was hoping to "have relations" before bed to help sleep but "the plan" was to wait until morning, since my wife had worked night shift previous night.

I ended up having a strange dream than included a dream-within-a-dream, a false awakening, and bizarre hypnagogic experiences.

I fell asleep without realizing it and, I guess, still worried about not sleeping. The first thing I remember dreaming (but thinking was real) was that I realized that I had "an emission" in my briefs, but don't remember doing so. (Was it a wet dream or "self-abuse"?) So I spent a minute with tissues trying to clean up, worried the sound of wiping would disturb my wife. I think there was a shuffling sound (hypnagogia?) that seemed to drown out and hide my activity, and ultimately I decided to leave the tissue inside on the damp area as a "sponge." (This sort of detail and strategy shows that I've had to deal with this sort of thing before!)

The strangest part of this dream was some time after this I can recall feeling like I was falling asleep (in my dream!) in such a way that I normally don't, feeling myself going deep into unconsciousness. But there was a "fear of falling" so to speak, as in what if I fell too far? And that is when I realized I must be entering sleep paralysis, but it never got scary, just strange. There was one moment I wondered if I was paralyzed but didn't try to move. There was a sound, like "Zzzzzzzzzz" and I wasn't sure if I was hearing it or making the sound myself. The sound would occasionally turn to "Vvvvvvvvv" and when it seemed like I might be doing it, I started to open my mouth to make sure that my lips were parted and my tongue not touching anything to make either the V or Z sound, and the sound continued! (Also, my partner did not awaken from sound if I was making it.) The final part of this sequence was my body started vibrating too, but not like in my old sleep paralysis. I was sort of shuddering and shaking violently, as if on a machine designed to do that. I'm not sure how long this lasted or what it led to, but it didn't wake me up (in the dream or in real life).

The next thing I remember is getting up at some later point realizing I hadn't slept much, and going into the kitchen and talking with my mother, discussing my insomnia. At one point she commented that "at least it isn't killing you!" to which I did what was supposed to be a silly or sarcastic (ironic?) prat fall where I just collapsed on the kitchen floor face down (in real life, I'd be hurt) and stayed down there long enough to register the short snickers.

But then I was confused because I saw the clock and it was 10:30 - in the MORNING. And I thought, wait, but I didn't sleep, and thought it was still shortly after midnight, at the latest. It SEEMED like day out, but then my mom shut all the curtains which seemed to block out more light than usual and it was VERY dark where I couldn't tell if it was day or night. So I spent a good minute in the dream confused about the time and if I had slept, and for ow long.

At this point I recalled the stain on my underwear and retreated to the bedroom to check on it, and found that the tissue was no longer there. It had fallen out in the bedroom and my mom's dog had gotten to it and shredded it (as usual), so there were little pieces of tissue on the floor. As I went to pick them up I noticed on the floor by the bed two projectile strips of what I realized with disgust was dog barf (from eating the tissue?), and even worse was I had two pairs of shoes by them and it had gotten on both pairs! I am very squeamish around vomit (having not gotten sick since 4th or 5th grade) and made an announcement that the dog got sick and for someone to clean it up. I was considering going back to bed but the thought of being in the room with the vomit was out of the question, and I suppose my discomfort with it is finally what caused me to REALLY wake up!

When I woke up I noticed that only 20 or 30 minutes had passed since I last saw the clock, so I must have gone directly into REM sleep. Luckily I was able to return to sleep and sleep fine until about 6:00 a.m. (When, as planned, we did "have relations," which I disclose only because of the encouraging footnote that AFTER, we cuddled and, with me flat on my back - a nearly impossible sleeping position nowadays - we both fell asleep until 8:00 a.m.!!! Though it meant a later start on our day, I was pleased to get the extra sleep and have slept so easily and unexpectedly.)

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taniaaust1
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby taniaaust1 » 14 May 2015 14:31

The strangest part of this dream was some time after this I can recall feeling like I was falling asleep (in my dream!) in such a way that I normally don't, feeling myself going deep into unconsciousness. But there was a "fear of falling" so to speak, as in what if I fell too far? And that is when I realized I must be entering sleep paralysis,


No in fact.. it was your own normal thinking mind and thoughts which created that feeling that you must be entering sleep paralysis cause you are a bit hung up on this.. so you started thinking you were entering it (as you expect it) when in fact you were in fact in sleep paralyses long before this but never realised it!!

I know that if I understood your post right as you were in a dream state when you were wiping yourself up with the tissue, (the tissue thing was part of a dream wasn't it???). So you weren't moving for real, you were in sleep paralyses then or otherwise you would been like sleep walking or moving around in bed actually acting out your dream.

The strangest part of this dream was some time after this I can recall feeling like I was falling asleep


You entered into the dream like people do with WILD, just a smooth flow in but in your case you weren't aware you did it so had no idea you were now in the dream state so for that reason it wasn't a WILD though you were normally aware. As nothing weird happened, you then didn't think to reality check so still continued on with your mind awake and aware but not knowing you were in dream. This is why later on you experienced yourself starting to go to sleep as you were then going to enter an unaware mind state at that point.. your normal waking mind was close to going to sleep/loose awareness.

but it never got scary, just strange. There was one moment I wondered if I was paralyzed but didn't try to move. There was a sound, like "Zzzzzzzzzz" and I wasn't sure if I was hearing it or making the sound myself. The sound would occasionally turn to "Vvvvvvvvv" and when it seemed like I might be doing it, I started to open my mouth to make sure that my lips were parted and my tongue not touching anything to make either the V or Z sound, and the sound continued!


You had your full awareness there by the sounds of it but you choose not to do a reality check (you just weren't open to the idea you could be actually asleep so kept on acting like you were awake).

Till you become more open to various LD states (its like your normal waking mind didnt even consider it)and possibility still holding some ideas which are blocking you, you are likely to keep missing your opportunities to become lucid and this was a very good one missed. (maybe you were thrown a bit by the fact you were moving around? eg you moved your mouth, wiped yourself etc.. watch that things like this don't go convincing yourself that you cant be in a dream if you are still waiting for SP which hasn't happened!! You bypassed experiencing it was in a dream long before you even thought about it).

The noise or some version of noise was probably you but altered by the fact you were sleeping so in that state all sounds get exaggerated and can sound a bit different. Deep down by the sounds of your post, I think a part of you knew it was you hence you tried hard to figure this out.

The next thing I remember is getting up at some later point realizing I hadn't slept much, and going into the kitchen and talking with my mother, discussing my insomnia. At one point she commented that "at least it isn't killing you!" to which I did what was supposed to be a silly or sarcastic (ironic?) prat fall where I just collapsed on the kitchen floor face down (in real life, I'd be hurt) and stayed down there long enough to register the short snickers.


By that point it sounds as if you were loosing your normal waking awareness at times. dream gapped out.. hence why at this point you started doing dream stuff which in real life you wouldn't do but with no awareness it was strange. By this point you had less chance of becoming aware you are asleep. (From that kind of sleep entry you had, it is easier to become fully lucid early in the dream).

But then I was confused because I saw the clock and it was 10:30 - in the MORNING. And I thought, wait, but I didn't sleep, and thought it was still shortly after midnight, at the latest. It SEEMED like day out, but then my mom shut all the curtains which seemed to block out more light than usual and it was VERY dark where I couldn't tell if it was day or night. So I spent a good minute in the dream confused about the time and if I had slept, and for ow long.


Another reality check miss, you were aware enough to question the situation and know it was weird. Best to really get into your brain to reality check with strange things. It's your normal waking mind which let you down some here.

If the dog spewing isn't common thing which happens there, a reality check should of been done there too.

B vitamins can cause insomnia and often hence are advised not to take right before sleep (just be aware of this). (I personally wont take B vitamins before sleep for that reason).

The magnesium for sleep.. that's a weird thing your doctor told you, I know many 100s of people with sleep issues due to the health forum I hang out in and not one has mentioned there about a doctor suggesting magnesium for sleep so I assume this doesn't normally work or otherwise people would be commonly be being suggested it. I don't understand how your doctor could of come to the conclusion you needed magnesium without even a blood test.


The stuff about the B6 though is true.

The fact you were staying the night somewhere else could of well been the trigger for this experience as staying elsewhere breaks in ones normal routine so can help aid in LD. (or it could of been the combo of the two things).

better luck next time but it may really help you if you work on training your mind or even just being determined to do it as in this dream I think you did have enough waking mind there to have otherwise done it.. to reality check on anything unusual had you'd already strongly made that decision to do so at such times. (you would of missed still the very first part of the dream but would of got to be lucid in the rest of it).

This dream due to its dream entry should of been easy to become aware that you were dreaming seeing you didn't loose any consciousness and held full waking consciousness there for a time. So I suggest to think about things and where you went wrong so you don't miss one next time.

This experience should show you that you can enter into a dream without loosing any waking awareness, without experiencing any sleep paralyses when that's happening. So don't expect it. I think you probably hadn't thought much about entering into a dream fully awake but without having any SP happening to you and this could of hindered you then from considering that you were having these experiences when fully asleep.

Ask yourself what were the reasons why you didn't seriously consider that you were dreaming....when you were awake in a dream and having weird experiences...was it this? if not what was it? (some block in thinking was there).

When I woke up I noticed that only 20 or 30 minutes had passed since I last saw the clock, so I must have gone directly into REM sleep.


Not necessarily so. We also dream in non REM. Non Rem dreams are very much like real life and don't tend to be very strange , non REM dreams are often about daily life things. This experience may not have been in REM .
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astrovineyard
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby astrovineyard » 15 May 2015 00:32

I beg to differ on this one part of what you said:

"No in fact.. it was your own normal thinking mind and thoughts which created that feeling that you must be entering sleep paralysis cause you are a bit hung up on this.. so you started thinking you were entering it (as you expect it) when in fact you were in fact in sleep paralyses long before this but never realised it!!"

Whether or not I dreamed I was in SP or actually having it, in truth, we ALL experience SP before becoming "aware" of it in the condition known as SP. So anyone who has the scary hallucination stuff was technically in SP before they became aware - and scared - the the sensation of the condition.

Still, it was an interesting dream, and not scary, so I don't see what was negative about it that requires pointing to some "hang-up." Lots of folks are terrorized by SP and afraid to go to sleep, and THAT hang-up, you might say, helps perpetuate the experiences. Since that is not happening to me, what is the problem?

astrovineyard
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby astrovineyard » 15 May 2015 04:49

taniaaust1 wrote:The noise or some version of noise was probably you but altered by the fact you were sleeping so in that state all sounds get exaggerated and can sound a bit different. Deep down by the sounds of your post, I think a part of you knew it was you hence you tried hard to figure this out.


Well, in a dream the sound IS you since you do the dreaming. I assume you meant I was vocalizing the sound, which is why I "reality checked" it by parting my lips and taking my tongue off the tip of my teeth so I couldn't make these sounds. In the dream it seemed these tiny mouth changes are within the realm of "limited motor ability" reported by many who experience SP and recommend stuff like wigging fingers, toes, neck, mouth, etc. to break free. But in my case the reality check seemed to convince me not that I was sleeping but was having SP albeit a mild one.

Another reality check miss, you were aware enough to question the situation and know it was weird. Best to really get into your brain to reality check with strange things. It's your normal waking mind which let you down some here.


A very difficult thing to accomplish. And the advice seems contradictory. On one hand I'm overthinking/dwelling/obsessing over these things - and in the next sentence I'm told I'm not trying hard enough, and mentally letting myself down. Sorry, but I just can't be THAT focused.

I've had WEIRD dreams in which I did not realize I was dreaming - like one where my arms had fallen off into a pile of leaves in the street and I had to find them (with no arms!) which I did, and they were gray and lifeless and I had to figure out how to reattach them so they'd grow back (again, with no arms!). Or more than a few where I had to walk carefully having had some skull surgery and worried if I bumped into something the top of my head would fall off. I mean, how weird does something have to be for me to recognize it in a dream? And what comes CLOSE to this in real life to practice on?

If the dog spewing isn't common thing which happens there, a reality check should of been done there too.


Funny you say this, but the cat just hurled for the first time in months yesterday. I am not a fan of barf, and I don't do it or deal with it. I haven't vomited in over 30 years! And that was based on a promise I made myself as a kid (probably still having SP and plotting to deal with that). Now, what if not willpower can overcome every stomach ache or virus that swept along my peers?

B vitamins can cause insomnia and often hence are advised not to take right before sleep (just be aware of this). (I personally wont take B vitamins before sleep for that reason).


You may be right - I am only taking B6, so perhaps the others are more involved in insomnia (like B12?). I seem to be doing fine taking B6 (100Mg) with Melatonin. And here is an article which seems to list pros and cons: http://www.progressivehealth.com/vitamin-b-and-its-impact-on-sleep.htm Note that it also mentioned magnesium. I did not plan that connection.

The magnesium for sleep.. that's a weird thing your doctor told you, I know many 100s of people with sleep issues due to the health forum I hang out in and not one has mentioned there about a doctor suggesting magnesium for sleep so I assume this doesn't normally work or otherwise people would be commonly be being suggested it. I don't understand how your doctor could of come to the conclusion you needed magnesium without even a blood test.


Well, he did not prescribe it for me, but merely suggested a Mg deficiency as a possible (and I guess in his experience) typical cause for insomnia. And since Mg is in multivitamins, which I don't take anymore, it seemed it could be my situation. But I haven't yet tried it.

But if that is not enough, I have seen this elsewhere, and if it helps now and then to include links, try this one: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23853635

better luck next time but it may really help you if you work on training your mind or even just being determined to do it as in this dream I think you did have enough waking mind there to have otherwise done it.. to reality check on anything unusual had you'd already strongly made that decision to do so at such times. (you would of missed still the very first part of the dream but would of got to be lucid in the rest of it).

This dream due to its dream entry should of been easy to become aware that you were dreaming seeing you didn't loose any consciousness and held full waking consciousness there for a time. So I suggest to think about things and where you went wrong so you don't miss one next time.


I'm still in the "get a good night sleep" phase post-insomnia, so am not doing any training yet.

(And yes, the "wiping off" was a within-the-dream activity.)

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taniaaust1
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby taniaaust1 » 15 May 2015 10:45

astrovineyard wrote:I beg to differ on this one part of what you said:

"No in fact.. it was your own normal thinking mind and thoughts which created that feeling that you must be entering sleep paralysis cause you are a bit hung up on this.. so you started thinking you were entering it (as you expect it) when in fact you were in fact in sleep paralyses long before this but never realised it!!"

Whether or not I dreamed I was in SP or actually having it, in truth, we ALL experience SP before becoming "aware" of it in the condition known as SP.


That's what I was saying, you already were in it but didn't experience it. You said in your writings that you felt yourself starting to go into it. You said " And that is when I realized I must be entering sleep paralysis" Thing is you were already in it and had long been in it but didn't realise or you would of been moving around physically when you were doing all the dream stuff before this feeling came in in bed. It's SP which stopped your body from acting out your dream.

It was illusionary what you were feeling due to your own thinking about it.. you didn't notice you were in SP till much later after you'd been in the dream a while and moving around etc. (you wouldn't have even noticed it if you didn't think about it and instead would of just continued moving around in this dream.. instead, you risked getting "stuck" cause you turned to thinking about SP and then hence started to think you were going into it .

So anyone who has the scary hallucination stuff was technically in SP before they became aware - and scared - the the sensation of the condition.


Nope Im going to disagree.. Ive had hallucinations without SP and have been able to actually move my physical body at times when Im getting HI. So that shows a person isn't necessarily in SP while getting "scary" halluncination stuff as you put it. Many a person has actually "physically" sat up in bed and still been seeing HI while still seeing HI and have it take a little while to go (hence it doesn't have to go with SP).

Still, it was an interesting dream, and not scary, so I don't see what was negative about it that requires pointing to some "hang-up." Lots of folks are terrorized by SP and afraid to go to sleep, and THAT hang-up, you might say, helps perpetuate the experiences. Since that is not happening to me, what is the problem?


A hang up can be a term used to say something is acting negativity on someone in some way and being caused by thoughts person cant let go of (the term doesn't necessary mean the experience was "scary").

In your case the negative reaction was it may of prevented you from achieving what you are hoping to achieve.. that being a LD, its helping stop you reach your goals. Due to a belief you have (or did have) that you need to have SP and "experience" it before you have a LD.
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astrovineyard
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby astrovineyard » 15 May 2015 12:47

Once again, I would at this point welcome EITHER LD or SP (which may or may not itself lead to LD). I know you can't believe that, but it is true. To me, it represents yet another opportunity of experience and potential entry into LD when all else fails. I DO appear to be more capable of spontaneously getting SP imagery to happen (rare that it is) compared to having legitimate LD. So why always put me down for trying to have SP or thinking it is a legitimate method for LD?

And, this time I need to look no further than this site's author's latest article! Take it away, Rebecca!

http://www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com/the-sleep-paralysis-gateway-to-lucid-dreams.html

I'd be more interested in you mincing words with her over the disagreement you have with what she is writing about here, than tying to convince me.

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taniaaust1
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby taniaaust1 » 20 May 2015 02:16

astrovineyard wrote:Once again, I would at this point welcome EITHER LD or SP (which may or may not itself lead to LD). I know you can't believe that, but it is true. To me, it represents yet another opportunity of experience and potential entry into LD when all else fails. I DO appear to be more capable of spontaneously getting SP imagery to happen (rare that it is) compared to having legitimate LD. So why always put me down for trying to have SP or thinking it is a legitimate method for LD?

And, this time I need to look no further than this site's author's latest article! Take it away, Rebecca!

http://www.world-of-lucid-dreaming.com/the-sleep-paralysis-gateway-to-lucid-dreams.html

I'd be more interested in you mincing words with her over the disagreement you have with what she is writing about here, than tying to convince me.


I've got nothing at all against Rebeccas stuff, this method "can be" a good method for "some".

Some things in your case though..

How long have you been trying to LD and in this time, how many actual sleep paralyses experiences have you had in THAT TIME?

(please answer this, I'm I've the understanding that you've been trying for a while and haven't had many SP experiences in that time). By Sleep paralyses and this question, Im not refering to various hypnagogia things but just sleep paralyses where one experiences the body as being paralysed (which is what SP actually is).

Rebecca says in the link you posted "If you're not prone to sleep paralysis before becoming a lucid dreamer, any spontaneous occurrences are limited."

This is true and they can be often increased by thinking of them if one is getting into the right kind of state for a LD (hence maintaining awareness while starting to go to sleep). In your case your SPs if I've understood your posts right, when you were a child, I know you are much much older then that now as somewhere I think I have read your age (you may of been something like 20 years older), so one can say you are not now days prone to SP. You do not even get even SP naturally or easily now.

Those who do LD from SP usually ended up with that technique as they were 1/ naturals at SP or 2/ found they went naturally into SP when just trying to LD or 3/ they can easily induce SP. For them it can be a very good technique, they aren't going to great efforts to try to get just into a SP state.

The technique for inducing sleep paralysis is simply one of falling asleep consciously. We've actually already explored it through the means of Wake Induced Lucid Dreams and the OBE state.

When you enter sleep paralysis deliberately, you're focused on your own internal dream world. The paralysis is simply a sign that it's working. It's a phase that can pass in seconds (and often, many people don't feel it at all).


the bolded above quote is from Rebecca off that link you gave.

You aren't managing to do this. You've been trying for a while and not managing to hold an awake state while going to sleep consciously to be able to get a SP at will easily.

So its like you are trying to aim for something which isn't easy for you and you may not even succeed in, with the goal to then be aiming for something else. (I know you keep saying you'll be happy just having a SP but the whole reason why you want SP is for a LD).

I don't try to pick on you, I'm trying to help you have a LD possibly sooner by helping you understand things better and not get hung up on one method which may end up not even working well for you. There is already evidence of this seeing how long you been trying to LD without luck. I'll say one of my favourite quotes "when things are failing with LD it usually means a change of ideas is needed".

Can you understand what I'm trying to say here? Nothing wrong with aiming for something if its working or likely to work for you but if something keeps failing, you probably need to be changing your thoughts about all this. And your natural childhood experiences with SP are way back in your past and probably not relevant at all now esp since that obviously hasn't worked yet for you after all this time.

I'm still curious for you to answer these two questions.
How long have you been trying to LD and in this time, how many actual sleep paralyses experiences have you had in THAT TIME? (not images but actually experiencing paralyses).

I hate to say this but I can imagine you, after a whole year of trying to LD, only maybe having 2-3 LD experiences behind you (if you are lucky) out of all the effort you've put in and telling all the beginners who come here, how hard LD is (which then impacts on others). Hence why I'm really trying to get you to try to change your mind set about it all and not be so set on one way so hopefully you will have better experiences. I really hope I'm wrong about this.

I hate to see people trying so hard and often for a long time to have a LD without any luck, its sad but very often it is related to the thoughts they carry and how they are going about it. Sometimes it can be a small thing just stopping someone from having LDs.

If Im bothering you at all, please just put me on block.
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taniaaust1
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Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby taniaaust1 » 20 May 2015 03:20

astrovineyard wrote:
taniaaust1 wrote:The noise or some version of noise was probably you but altered by the fact you were sleeping so in that state all sounds get exaggerated and can sound a bit different. Deep down by the sounds of your post, I think a part of you knew it was you hence you tried hard to figure this out.


Well, in a dream the sound IS you since you do the dreaming.


Just cause one is in a dream doesnt mean one cant hear sounds from outside of it and hence sounds not from oneself. When I'm doing WILD, I can sometimes hear sounds which are from outside of the dream.

astrovineyard wrote: I assume you meant I was vocalizing the sound, which is why I "reality checked" it by parting my lips and taking my tongue off the tip of my teeth so I couldn't make these sounds. In the dream it seemed these tiny mouth changes are within the realm of "limited motor ability" reported by many who experience SP and recommend stuff like wigging fingers, toes, neck, mouth, etc. to break free. But in my case the reality check seemed to convince me not that I was sleeping but was having SP albeit a mild one.


As I said before, it isn't a good reality check and if one wants to know if one is dreaming or not.. far better to do one of the common reality checks which people do to find out if they are dreaming or not.

astrovineyard wrote:
taniaaust1 wrote: Another reality check miss, you were aware enough to question the situation and know it was weird. Best to really get into your brain to reality check with strange things.


A very difficult thing to accomplish. And the advice seems contradictory. On one hand I'm overthinking/dwelling/obsessing over these things - and in the next sentence I'm told I'm not trying hard enough, and mentally letting myself down. Sorry, but I just can't be THAT focused.


Isnt the whole LD contradictory :) Mind awake, body asleep. Believing you couldn't possible ever become aware enough to realise that something is strange in a dream and do a reality check to that strange thing, is a not a good mind set to have when wanting to LD.

I don't even think you've tried to program your mind to become aware of strange things as per advice I've previously given. Instead you just think these things are impossible for you. You cant just expect yourself to become aware at strange things in your dreams without even bothering to even trying to program yourself to do this (though it does just came naturally for some).

I've had WEIRD dreams in which I did not realize I was dreaming - like one where my arms had fallen off into a pile of leaves in the street and I had to find them (with no arms!) which I did, and they were gray and lifeless and I had to figure out how to reattach them so they'd grow back (again, with no arms!). Or more than a few where I had to walk carefully having had some skull surgery and worried if I bumped into something the top of my head would fall off. I mean, how weird does something have to be for me to recognize it in a dream?


Nothing odd about that, many wont realise when they are dreaming strange stuff unless they put a little bit of work in so they do (with programming themselves).

And what comes CLOSE to this in real life to practice on?


That's a good question. It doesn't have to come close.. just program yourself to reality check at "unusual stuff". The very very weird will then also full under that category.

astrovineyard wrote:
Funny you say this, but the cat just hurled for the first time in months yesterday. I am not a fan of barf, and I don't do it or deal with it. I haven't vomited in over 30 years! And that was based on a promise I made myself as a kid (probably still having SP and plotting to deal with that).


The cat spews only every few months, that's not an every day common thing so can be put into the more unusual category. A reality check could of been done to that to help program yourself to do them to unusual things.


astrovineyard wrote: Now, what if not willpower can overcome every stomach ache or virus that swept along my peers?


It doesn't mean its a will power thing, some people just aren't prone to vomit often even when they are ill. It takes a heck of a lot to make me throw up (other then with heart burn reflux stuff). I can feel as sick as a dog as that saying goes, feel like Im turning all shades of green but still not vomit. Maybe you should of cleaned up that dog sick the other day and the cat sick rather then just get another to do it instead to test how much willpower you have not to vomit :lol:

You may be right - I am only taking B6, so perhaps the others are more involved in insomnia (like B12?).


Now that I cant answer, so perhaps. I know B12 is one of the Bs which causes insomnia as it does it to me a bit.

Well, he did not prescribe it for me, but merely suggested a Mg deficiency as a possible (and I guess in his experience) typical cause for insomnia. And since Mg is in multivitamins, which I don't take anymore, it seemed it could be my situation. But I haven't yet tried it.

But if that is not enough, I have seen this elsewhere, and if it helps now and then to include links, try this one: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23853635


I can believe that Magnesuim deficiency can cause insomnia, vitamin deficiencies can cause lots of different problems but I still say magnesium deficiency a very uncommon cause of peoples insomina I know lots of people with sleep issues but it hasn't been caused by that. I think your doctor was irresponsible by suggesting to you it may of been that without a blood test to say so. Esp since you know it was first caused by the LD stuff you did.
The only thing to fear is the fear itself

astrovineyard
Posts: 149
Joined: 29 Jan 2015 04:49

Re: Vitamin B6 and lucid dreaming

Postby astrovineyard » 21 May 2015 04:35

Wow, I'd like to respond but don't know where to begin! No, I won't block you. You've been the most active responder to my posts. Why, I don't know - is it specifically mine you are drawn to or do you happen to be the top commenter to the posting community in general?

I'll do this as I think of them:

The doctor, again, was no prescribing magnesium. He just was making a guess in lieu of a blood test. "It could be this, or this" kind of thing.

I seem to be over it now, even though I continue to have a low dose melatonin before bed (when I notice I am tired already) and also some chamomile tea since the area around my vineyard is a field of the stuff growing wild! Oh, and yes, I take the B6, so short of courting disaster, it does not seem to be affecting my sleep negatively, so soon after having and getting over insomnia. It has been a few weeks in the clear now.

I don't think you should discredit my attempt to do a reality check in a dream. Remember I so often FORGET to do them when I realize (after the fact) that I SHOULD have. And amid my odd "Vvvvvv" sound experience, I thought it was pretty clever quick thinking to realize that a "V" sound is made with top teeth against the bottom lip, so if I am making the sound myself then parting my lips from my teeth would stop it. When the sound continued, it made me lucid, but in a limited sense because I was lucid of a dream in which I was experiencing hypnagogia, and then later lost control and drifted into some other dream. But it is a start, no?

Perhaps I am too long without having SP for it to be a reliable method for LD. But at least I HAD SP and not real LD. The only recent SP episode I had was one of the few times I tried the Galantamine and was a bit sleep deprived besides. It was brief and only mildly scary. So, I guess as an experience it is still POSSIBLE but to WHAT EXTENT (depth and duration) I don't know.

I just became so darned good at waking up INSTINCTIVELY whenever dreams went sour or sinister. Whether or not I outgrew the SP itself, or simply am able to snap awake the instant things become suspicious I'll never know but it is not an ability I seem able to shut off now.

This is what I meant about willpower, whether in preventing SP (now against my wishes) or never becoming sick in over 30 years. And both things were things I willed I would accomplish as a child. The SP ended, and I made a vow never to vomit again - is it just a coincidence that I never did again, or do I get no credit for it?

I've stated my reasons for wanting SP. Yes, as a possible gateway to LD (because I've had SP) but also for nostalgic purposes, to see how I'd react now to the terror if I found I couldn't wake up from it. There is a "safe" thrill-seeking aspect to it, I suppose. So even if I ONLY got an SP episode that knocked the wind out of me, that would qualify as "vivid dream" because really I am just trying to enhance the dreaming part of sleep to be more than how I view cars: a means to get me "from point A to point B," namely from tiredness to wakefulness.

And I wouldn't downplay the temporal distance of my childhood SP. To this day, some 30-40 years later they remain THE most vivid and memorable dreams OR WAKING MEMORIES I've had, then or since. That must count for something, surely, even if every cell and molecule in my body is different from those that existed in that shy boy who unwittingly and helplessly dreamed them.

(Same memorable vividness is true, but from a positive/euphoric experience, with regards to a handful of awkward but pleasant wet dreams, something else I seem to have no control over having if I'd like. Hence "erotic LDs" are also enticing.)

I can't tell you how much time I've devoted to LDs. On and off over the years is all I can say, some times more than others. Usually it is distraction, business, laziness or lack of discipline. But HONESTLY, were it not for the annoying INSOMNIA, I'd still be practicing all the VARIOUS LD tricks on suggestion parade. The only thing stopping me is NOT fear of SP, but return of insomnia. Which is why I'd like reassurances against that, or better methods for dealing with it. Otherwise I'm determined.

This is why I don't think you are fair in saying that I shouldn't "scare away the newbies" with my fabled tales of insomnia, or warnings of encountering terrifying SP. You make it sound my case is so unique and rare, when in fact it is people who can LD are a minority. The reasons stopping them may be many, but if it were so easy AND amazing you'd think everyone would be doing it, especially to replace the expensive and dangerous escapism of illegal drugs some take. I wish I was warned. Is the percentage of failed LD due to insomnia truly less than the percentage of the total population who LD, as you suggested? When your dealing within a niche community, I don't think you can claim anything truly as "normal" or "typical."

Did I miss anything?


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